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Journalist Matthew Yglesias writes about politics and economic policy at Vox.com, a site he co-founded, and also co-hosts The Weeds: a regular podcast devoted to current events. Yglesias is also the author of two books, the most recent of which is One Billion Americans: The Case for Thinking Bigger.
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I don't know. I don't know either. I like vaccines, you know. Yeah. I'm excited. Um, I like vaccines. I am vaccinated. I mean, not everybody does, I know. Um, the problem that a lot of people have is that this was fast-tracked and they get nervous about... They do. They do. ...possible potential side effects and we don't know what those are going to be and then there's a lot of people that are very uncomfortable with the idea of getting very sick. After they take the vaccine, which seems to happen with 80% of the people that take it. And so they're concerned about that. Wait, 80% of people who are taking this vaccine? That's not what I heard. Well, that's what Bill Gates has said. Bill Gates? Yeah. I don't know. I mean, I don't know if we can look it up. We'll play it for you. Pull it off of... I know. It's weird. When people say that, people are like, wait, what? Um, it's on my Instagram. There's an interview with Bill Gates where he's talking about, I believe this is the Moderna vaccine. The Pfizer vaccine has a very similar effect because it's the way this mRNA vaccine works. They've taken the common cold vaccine and added this to it. Your body develops these proteins to fight off, but you get sick. Yeah, I mean, well, I get them say, I don't know. You know, I mean, I've read the sort of report, the readout from Pfizer and Moderna by Antek. And they said there were very few serious side effects. I mean, I don't know. I don't know if serious or not. I mean, I got the flu shot, you know, whenever it was a couple months ago. And you know, my arm hurt for a couple days. Well, that's just the shot side. I wouldn't do it just for fun. That's just the injection. Yeah. But your body didn't feel bad, right? But it was fine, you know, I felt okay. This is different than that. This is different than that. And there's a consequence of taking this. And I'm not saying that I won't take it. I will. And if it's safe, I will encourage other people to take it too. But there's a reality of taking this particular vaccine that it's going to make a lot of people feel like shit. And it'll last a couple days. And look, you can play play that video. Oh, okay. But it's in the it's in the feed. It's in the IGTV. But if you just go to my Instagram feed from the last time, the the Dylan Jones episode, it's it's that's just what it is. Hold up. You want way too far. Go go way up. Way up. Hold on. Keep going. Wait a minute. Did they remove it? Oh, my God. Did they remove it from my Instagram? Is that real? Holy shit, dude. That is crazy. Hold on. Let me check. Because that's kind of crazy. If they removed it from my Instagram, that's kind of crazy. Because this was a I believe it was an NBC interview. Oh, they removed it. Wow. Okay, well, here, here I got I got an article from from science. It says there's fever and aches that are intense in some cases, but not dangerous. You found it. Okay. Okay. It hasn't removed that. Okay, here we go. Here's a bear. Why don't I find it? I don't know. It was a month ago. It says October 28. Right. Okay, play. This video is edited, though. Remember? Also. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. That's a totally different video. That's a totally different video. That video was the video where people were talking about that Bill Gates is concerned with the profit margin from vaccines. But that is we should talk about that too. That's actually important. That's actually important because that's really distorted. And that's not what he was saying at all. He was not talking about profit concerning. We looked after the second dose, at least 80% of participants experienced a systemic side effect ranging from severe chills to fevers. So are these vaccines safe? Well, the the FDA not being pressured will look hard at that. The FDA is the gold standard of regulators and their current guidance on this, if they stick with that, is very, very appropriate. And, you know, the side effects were not super severe. That is, it didn't cause permanent health problems for the things that are they, you know, Moderna did have to go with a fairly high dose. And so, you know, to get the antibodies, some of the other vaccines are going able to go with lower doses to get responses that are pretty high, including the J&J and the Pfizer. And so there's a lot of characteristics of these vaccines. It's great that we have multiple of them that are going out there. And yes, I think you know the data better than I do. But the bill that the data show that everybody with a high dose had a side effect. Yeah, but some of that is not dramatic where, you know, it's just, you know, super painful. But yes, there we need to make sure there's not severe side effects. The FDA, I think will do a good job of that despite the pressure. How many doses of the vaccine will we need? Well, none of the vaccines at this point appear like they'll work with a single dose. That was the hope at the very beginning. Maybe one of them, particularly in the second generation, won't surprise us. We hope just to, although in the elderly, sometimes it takes more. And so making sure we have lots of elderly people in the trial will give us that data. No, so let's be clear. If that is all it is, it's just you have severe chills and you feel like shit for a couple of days. That is way better than getting the coronavirus and risking the potential death and side effects and, you know, the long haul people experiencing blood clots. And if it's better than that, yeah, but it's not a free ride. So I just want to get the numbers. What I see here from science is that the sort of fatigue, you know, that you were talking about, feel like shit for two days. There's about 10% of people had the side effects. Which hold on a second, but why is Bill Gates saying 80%? Well, no, she was saying it's some side effect comes in 80%. Right. But like what you were talking about is in a subset, you know, of the people get it. Well, I don't know. I don't know if that's true because there's many articles about the side effects of this vaccine. I've never seen one of them that relegated it to 10% of the population that took the vaccine. I mean, obviously, the second dose. Yeah. The other thing about this is you have to take two. The second dose seems to be the doozy for people. Right. I mean, I guess that's the tough one. There's some, um, now, do you think, so there's something that's interesting is I have like one set of conversations with people and they're saying, who's going to be able to get the vaccine? Like how are we going to roll this out? You know, healthcare workers, essential workers, all this other kind of stuff. And then there's another conversation where people are like, maybe you're not going to want to get it. Right. And me, I'm like, I'm really eager, you know, give it to me tomorrow. I don't even care that the FDA is not done. Why is that? Um, you're not worried about side effects? Hey, I'm not worried about side effects. Why are you not worried about side effects? Guys fever for a couple of days. I mean, what if that's all we know of now? Yeah. But look, long haul COVID survivors. One of the things they're finding is these people have blood clots like many, many months later. No, I mean, I know. Serious, serious. Like I, I would really like to not get COVID. Yeah. Sure. So what if there's a similar situation with the vaccine? What is the vaccine? And this is not outside the realm of possibility that the vaccine gives some sort of a side effect that that's unintended. I mean, I have a lot of confidence in the basic process here, uh, with the vaccine development. But this isn't the basic process. This is a completely new process, much faster than any process that we've had. Well, I mean, it's an unusually rapid development of vaccines. I mean, it's an unusually rapid development because they have this MNR, M R N A. I don't know what that means. I mean, it's messenger RNA, but I don't know what it means. Um, so it just means that it's trick. It's not giving you a, like a dormant version of COVID. Right. So, so there's no, there's no virus, right? There's a particle that's specially designed. It triggers antibodies. Yeah. We create them. Um, and so I think the basic antibody immune response situation is fairly well understood scientifically. It's why we're pretty confident that the people who've recovered, you know, are immune that, you know, younger and healthier people in most cases are okay. If they get sick, they get better. Um, so to me, like it's a good thing. I'm all for it. I'll take it. I'll get the fever, but I'm also not, I want to walk the line. Like I want to encourage people to take vaccines, like as a responsible person, but also knowing that the supplies will be short. If somebody doesn't want it, like somebody else will take that dose. But you know, one, one of the best things, uh, in terms of, uh, outcomes is vitamin D, like vitamin D deficiencies are a huge part of, uh, negative COVID outcomes. And then, uh, one in one study, some people, some studies about that. Yeah. One study, 84% of the people that were in the ICU had deficient levels of vitamin C and only 4% had sufficient levels of vitamin D vitamin D is a huge problem. And it's not just a vitamin, it's a hormone. You know, when, when Mackey was on the other day, he was trying to say that it's a precursor to a hormone. So I had to look it up. That's not true. It's a hormone. Vitamin D is actually a hormone and it's weird because we call it a vitamin, but it regulates so many things in the body and it has a significant impact on the immune system, but you never hear anybody telling you to supplement with vitamin D. You're not seeing this from any of the leaders, any of these politicians that are shutting things down. Even Fauci has said it recently that vitamin D does seem to have a pretty significant impact, but health experts, like people that study like the mechanisms of disease and vitamin supplementation, like particularly a Dr. Rhonda Patrick had a thing on her Twitter, which she published a study that showed positive outcomes and COVID. Vitamin D is a huge factor. Catch new episodes of the Joe Rogan experience for free only on Spotify. Watch back catalog JRE videos on Spotify, including clips, easily, seamlessly switch between video and audio experience on Spotify. 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