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Bradley Cooper is an Academy Award-nominated actor, writer, producer, and director. His film credits include “American Sniper,” “A Star Is Born,” and “The Hangover.” His latest film, “Is This Thing On?,” which he directed and co-stars in, is now in theaters. https://www.searchlightpictures.com/is-this-thing-on
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Joe Rogan Podcast, check it out.
The Joe Rogan Experience.
Train by day, Joe Rogan Podcast by night, all day.
Hey, Bradley Cooper, what's happening, baby?
You know what it's like when, like a Twilight Zone episode or something, where
like you're
watching the TV, this is an episode where like I'm watching the TV.
And then all of a sudden you're inside the show.
And all of a sudden, and you're looking at me.
Oh.
Yeah, and all of a sudden I'm inside the show.
It's crazy.
It's weird for me too.
It's weird for me that it gets weird for other people too.
Like when I see people being weird about it, I'm like, it's okay.
I feel comfortable, just so you know.
Oh, good.
You look comfortable.
No, no, no.
It's excitement.
It's weird for me.
Like I was trying to explain this to someone, they're like, do people have a
hard time being
comfortable on the show?
I go, I kind of do too.
It's fucking weird.
Yeah.
It's weird that that many people are watching.
Yes.
And then you start thinking like, oh, don't fuck it up.
Don't say that.
Right.
But if you think about it, the fact that you did this long form setup and that
we live
in a culture where people at least say that it's all about short term.
Yeah.
It goes against it.
The people are interested.
Yeah.
Well, the short term stuff does work.
You know, like short attention span stuff is very popular, even with me.
Like, but I have been resisting it more and more lately.
I'm like, like a fucking heroin addict, like slowly weaning myself off the drug.
And the more I wean myself, the better I feel like physically better.
My brain works better.
I feel more relaxed.
I don't feel like this like Sugar Sean O'Malley, the UFC fighter.
He said, even when I'm just scrolling, even if he goes, even if it's not
anything about
me, he goes, there's just like a low level anxiety that I get.
I'm like, yeah, yeah.
Because like, you know, you're wasting your time chasing a fix that you're
never going
to get.
And you're just like getting these short drips of like, oh, look at that.
Oh, look at that.
Oh, scroll, scroll, scroll, scroll.
But that's not what people really want.
What people really want is something engaging, something you go, wow, that's
like a great
documentary, like, which are still super popular, like a great documentary.
They're still, you know, like huge on Netflix and huge on YouTube.
So there's always.
And Oppenheimer was like three hours long.
Right.
Exactly.
And made a billion dollars.
Exactly.
So people went.
Humans didn't change.
It's just you can hijack the reward system by giving them some short attention
span nonsense.
And it just like tricks their slow drip dopamine into like continuing to watch
this stupid shit.
But that's not what they want.
No.
You know, it's not what I want.
No.
It's the difference between like, yeah, just a little drip of something that
has the illusion
that I'm getting what I want as opposed to what I actually need.
Yes.
Which is sort of a reminder that I exist.
Yes.
Yes.
And that I'm communicating with somebody and I can relate to it.
Yes.
Which is a different thing.
And I only know this because I've never been on social media.
But sometimes there was one time I got on somehow got on TikTok and it was all
police footage.
You know, like and I was just I remember laying on my couch.
Forty minutes went by and I was just doing this.
And there was like the first part of the video.
And then what happened?
And then like the second part.
Part two.
And that was the only time I experienced I thought I got to stay away from this
because
I won't leave the house.
It's bad.
It's bad for you too because it programs you to think that that is going on
everywhere in
the world.
Like if you have eight billion people that are interacting with people all over
the world
and you only take the worst examples of that and broadcast it and then it
becomes viral and
millions and millions of people think it rewires your way you think about human
beings.
But the other thing is about memory.
Someone was talking about Niagara Falls the other day and I thought I've been
there, right?
And I'm like, have I been there?
Or did I see a video?
Like or was that one of the things when I put the Oculus on?
Right, right, right.
Honestly, I can't remember, but I know what it feels like to be looking at it.
Oh, yeah.
So it's changing the way memory works.
100%.
Yeah.
I've hit a wall in my memory, like a tangible wall because, and I think it's
connected to
like Dunbar's number.
Like Dunbar's number is the amount of people that you can keep in your head
because we evolved
in these tribal scenarios.
We evolved with like 150 people.
And so the way Dunbar calculated it, there's like very close, intimate, close
circle people,
which is a small amount.
And then immediately after that, there's a slightly larger amount.
And then it gets up to, what was it like?
It gets up to like 1,000 people.
1,500.
1,500 people.
That's the most amount of people you can keep in your head.
So it's like five people that like your tightest of tight.
And then 15, like slightly outside of that.
And it gets all the way up to about 1,500 people.
I would think I'd be able to, that you could keep in your head.
Yeah.
But I'm way past 1,500 people.
So I'm fucked.
Right.
Like I am like, there's people that I know really well.
And then I see them and I'm like, I don't remember his name.
1,500 sounds weird.
And it seems bad.
Like I'm like, why can't I remember his fucking name?
I can't remember his name.
I'm horrible with names.
But it's just because my hard drive sucks.
It's like, I don't have enough room.
Right.
It's like, you know, when you, the old iPhones, it was like, you've run out of,
you know, max space.
Like, oh, geez, I got to start deleting photos and videos.
Now, do you get anxiety with that?
Or do you sort of breathe through and say, well, it's just the way it is?
I kind of just deal with it.
Yeah, me too.
It is what it is.
But my memory itself is like very good and also very bad at the same time.
Yeah, me too.
I have a serious problem remembering people's names.
Well, you think about how many people you meet.
Like, as I was saying it, I was like, and I've watched the show so many times.
I was like, Jamie.
Right, that's Jamie.
Like, as you were saying, I'm like, let me see who can I remember.
Do I remember any of the guys I just met?
I can't tell you one.
I just met them, shook their hand, looked them in their eyes.
They say their names and it just goes in and out.
Yeah.
And some people get upset.
What's my name?
I know.
I don't fucking know.
Oh, you don't remember me?
I'm like, you don't remember?
What's my name?
And you're like, oh.
Well, that's why in Hollywood, people love to say, good to see you.
Instead of nice to meet you, like, bitch, you met me two years ago.
Like, I don't remember.
Yeah.
Leonard Bernstein had a great thing that he would always do.
I loved you in the last thing you did.
That's funny.
That's funny.
Speaking of which, I watched your movie.
Is this thing on?
And it's good.
It's really good, man.
Oh, thanks, man.
It's one of the best representations of someone attempting to do stand-up.
It's a really good film.
And, you know, but it's not really just about stand-up.
It's about these people with this, it's about, they're actual human beings.
Like, these are complicated, real, like, not caricature-ish, not cartoonish
people.
Like, I get that these are real people.
Right, good.
Complicated, real people that are trying to figure out their relationships.
Good.
And in the context of this one guy, Will Arnett, is attempting to do stand-up.
Right.
So it was great.
I'm glad you say that, because, you know, I moved to New York in 97, and then
that was
my introduction to any comedy world.
Other than with my dad, I used to watch Rodney Dangerfield's, you know, New
Year's Eve special.
We used to watch it every year, you know, and it was Elaine Boosler and Sam
Kennison and
Dice and, you know.
Yeah, Elaine Boosler.
I forgot about that.
I'm pretty sure she was on there, yeah.
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I was obsessed with Dice when I was, like, in eighth grade.
I memorized one of his records, and I would do it in the train station with all
my friends.
Because back then, that's all you did, right?
You would memorize stuff.
Oh, yeah, me too.
Yeah, there was no video to look at.
You know, you wouldn't all sit around.
You would just memorize and then, you know, regale your friends with your
impersonation
of them.
And then, and Richard Pryor was my hero, hero growing up.
That was my idol.
So I had this thing with stand-up comedy, and then I moved to New York, and I'm
all of a
sudden immersed with these clubs, and Upright Citizens Brigade had just started,
and I did this movie, What Hot American Summer, and there was all these people.
I didn't even know about the state.
Remember that show on MTV?
There was a show.
Uh-huh.
Yeah, all this.
And so I just, you know, little by little immersed myself into that world, and
I just
became fascinated with the culture.
And then Zach Galifianakis, who I met, like, in 2001, way before Hangover, I
used to go
and watch him do stuff.
And I just love the culture.
And when Will was telling me about this, I was like, oh, let's set it in New
York, in
the cellar.
Because I just love the geography of the cellar, too, that you go in the olive
tree, and you
walk down into this place.
It's this whole other world.
And it just felt like, yeah, I really wanted, like, can we pull this off where
it's authentic,
where you were watching it at home, and you get a sense of the fact that you're
saying
that, you know, you feel like it got it, you know, within the striking distance
makes
me really happy.
Yeah, it's striking distance.
It's, like, one of the only films.
Like, Punchline was an interesting film, the Tom Hanks, Sally Fields.
Yeah, yeah, of course.
But it was bullshit.
Like, you watch it, like, what, they got lockers?
Like, what the fuck is this?
And also, the comedy wasn't good.
It wasn't real comedy.
It was, like, it felt flat and fake, and people were laughing at nothing.
The Will stuff felt real.
Yeah.
It felt real, you know?
Like, the clubs felt like a guy trying to work out what it's like to be on
stage, an open
mic.
And then the fact you got Jordan Jensen in, who I love.
Yeah, of course.
She was fucking great.
I texted her afterwards.
I'm like, you killed it.
Isn't she great in the movie?
She's great.
Yeah, she's so natural.
I mean, the minute I started shooting her, I was like, oh, wait a second.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was like, and the first thing I had shot with her was one of her sets, and I
was just
up there with the camera, and I came around, and her profile, and actually, I
felt
like I was in the stars more, and she looked a lot like Gaga and Allie, like,
singing
Shallow.
Oh, wow.
And I had, like, this weird moment.
I was like, whoa.
And then she was just incredible.
And then as it went on, she had a larger part of the movie, and then that whole
thing
when they're talking about the small penis, and we go up to her, and just her
writing
that down, and she was just so fluid.
And I was like, oh, yeah, she's got it, man.
She's got it.
She's great.
She's really great.
She's a really unique person.
Like, a very unusual person.
Like, even just talking to her on the podcast.
Oh, yeah.
Grew up on a farm with two moms.
Yeah.
Yeah, amazing.
Yeah.
She could do anything.
I know.
And she's so fun.
She's fun on stage, too.
Like, she's great.
Like, working in the crowds.
Very smart.
Very smart.
Very smart.
But, like, her character, like, the way she interacted, I'm like, oh, that's so
realistic.
Like, we should fuck.
Like, that scene.
Yeah, exactly.
And then you go back to the, like, East Village or Chinatown apartment.
You know, they live in one tall one room.
Yeah.
I believe it.
Yeah, me too.
It was great.
It's, like, you know, you're never going to really capture stand-up in a movie
because
it's, like, to capture what it is, you would need, like, years and months.
And also, you would need a movie dedicated to it.
Exactly.
The movie's not dedicated to it.
Exactly.
Do you know what I mean?
It was just about, can I make you feel like you're there watching, that you're
with him
on stage?
Yes.
What that could be like.
Yeah.
You know, the silence.
And then the cameras, boom.
There's nowhere to go.
How did you work out the stand-up scenes?
Did you have real audiences?
It was never just real audiences because you have to hit the quota of extras
with SAG and
all that.
But we tried to do it as authentic as possible, which was everybody that works
at the cellar,
they're there in the movie.
Everybody who agreed to do it.
So all the waiters and everything, the staff, that's all people that work there.
Liz, who's the manager, who plays the manager, she's the manager of the cellar.
So all those people are real.
But then the patrons, I can't remember what the email was or what the ask was,
but people
who like to go to stand-up comedy, who go regularly.
And then once they were there, I never told them what was going to happen.
I never directed them once.
It was like, whatever they're laughing at, that's it.
And I don't do many takes.
So you're getting an authentic reaction.
Now it's hyped up because there's cameras there and it's a movie, but they're
not told what
to do.
It feels like that.
And even in the mix, we never added anything.
There was no added laugh, nothing.
Oh, that's great.
Yeah, yeah.
It's all, because I was like, it's just got to be real.
Because I wanted Will to just, you know, I just don't want him to act.
Right, right, right.
I just want him to, and that's why, you know, Shane Gillis was kind enough.
The first time he went up was here at the Mothership.
Shane gave him four minutes of his set.
And he and I, and Will and I flew to Austin and we're sitting in the green room
and Shane
was like an hour and a half late and Tony was there and he was so nice.
I'd never met Tony before.
And that's where I smelled the thing.
You know, I did this.
Oh, the smell like Austin.
Yeah, dude, fuck me.
That shit is no joke, dude.
Yeah.
And that was the first time Will ever went up.
And we were just trying some of that material and went up as Alex Novak.
Because I was like, when do you have an opportunity as an actor to actually do
the thing you're
preparing to do?
Like, you could, and like, think about how much that would cost.
Like, you go into a room where there's real people, it's all, and then every
step that
you're taking, you're in a club.
So he did that.
And then when we went back to New York, he did it like three times a week, four
or five
times a night for like six weeks.
Wow.
Just so he could understand what it's like.
And some people didn't know who he was.
You know, you get a lot of tourists come into New York City and there were
nights where
you knew that he, when he said Alex Novak, they're like, cool.
Right.
Not like you're not Alex Novak.
You know, they're like, okay, let's see what you got.
And so that was really, that was really great.
How did you, who wrote this film?
He wrote it with this guy, Mark Chappell.
It was a, it was a movie that was more about his, based on this guy, John
Bishop, who's
a real comedian, is a very successful comedian in the UK.
And, and he, Will met that guy on a barge somewhere and, and he was at talking
about his story and
he was like, yeah, I was in, I was doing something else.
My wife and I were breaking up and I walked into a bar, a pub one night.
I didn't want to pay the cover.
That really happened to this guy.
So he put his name down and then they called him and then he was like, yeah, I'm
getting
a divorce and got a couple of chuckles, but he just loved it.
Never done comedy, nothing before that.
And he kept going back and he like was obsessed by it.
And then like weeks later, his wife, a strange wife walked into a place he was
doing an open
mic at with her girlfriends and he was doing a set about their relationship.
So that actually happened.
Wow.
I know.
And then they got back together and they're still together.
And then now he like, he tours around the world.
Like he's makes a living as a comedian.
That's incredible.
Yeah.
So when he was telling me that I was doing another movie and I remember I was
like, what
are you working on?
Cause we've been friends for, for like 25 years.
And, um, and he was telling me that and I was like, I just imagine Will, cause
I know him
so well and he's so charismatic and funny and just has this presence that, that
is kind
of lacking.
I don't feel like there's like a male archetype now that fits him.
He's like, he's like Robert Mitchum.
He reminds me of like a young Robert Mitchum, Will Arnett.
And he's telling me that I'm like his voice and like that face, standup comedy,
I just
couldn't get it out of my head, Joe.
And I was like, Hey man, can I, can I read it?
Like how far along are you guys?
And I read it and I was like, I didn't quite, because like you, I had never
seen a movie
that I thought nailed it.
And I love standup comedy so much.
I was like, and I have no desire to try to redo it.
And also comedy is so massive right now.
And the specials are so great and cinematic right now that there's no reason to
try to
make a fictional movie about something that we can watch as a documentary or a
docu-series
or a show that is authentic.
I was like, so, but I still would really love to capture it cinematically.
So what if it's a foil and the movie's about the two of them?
Cause that's interesting.
Yes.
And you suck.
That was one of the great scenes where Jordan was like, you're bad.
Yeah.
She's like, you're bad.
You're really bad.
And it's much more about just what, what standup comedy, with anything.
And you talk about this on your show, doing anything that puts you out of your
comfort zone.
Yeah.
Anything that pushes you, you're going to, you're going to improve as a human
being.
That was really what that, that whole thing is about.
And I just love the culture and the world.
And I thought there's so much tangible stuff there for me to get excited about
cinematically
and story-wise.
But really it's like, it could have been anything.
Yeah.
Just something that he'd never done that had, he had put himself out there and
that in doing
it and doing it, he just sort of gets more comfortable and, you know, and then
the mic
comes off the stand and then he's leaning against the wall and by the end of it,
and then the
way it was structured, it allows him to do that vampire set at the end of the
movie where
all he's doing is exercising what he's feeling emotionally because he's
comfortable in this
setting.
Yeah.
Because the old him, when he has that fight with her in the attic, he just
would have kept
that all inside and he would have been canatonic at his kid's assembly where we
meet him in
the beginning of the movie because you just don't know what to do with all that.
But if you have an outlet, something expressive, you can, you can, you know,
exercise it in
a healthy way.
Yeah.
So that, that's, that, that's, that really was the point of that whole part of
it being
standup comedy and open mic.
What you really nailed is someone trying it for the first time.
You guys really nailed that.
You really nailed a beginner in comedy.
Like it seemed completely realistic.
Great.
Yeah.
And like, I think that's one of the reasons why Kill Tony is so popular.
Yes.
You know, cause you get to see, like you can't, that, that raw reality of
someone who has
never done standup before.
Like there was people that went up at Madison square garden in front of 16,000
people that
had never done standup before.
Dude.
No, no, no, that's just, who knows.
Don't do that.
Yeah.
You should be in a fucking smoky room.
Well, not smoky anymore, but a tiny fucking room where disinterested people,
where everyone's
bombing and you bomb to it.
It's not that big a deal.
Right.
Cause you might have some potential, but if you fucking bomb in front of 16,000
people,
the pain of that, you may never recover.
Also just think about the, like, cause you're going to hear your voice through
the, you know,
echoing.
It's, it's can't be just in it.
Like, so there, I imagine there's an echo.
So you're not only bombing, but you're hearing it reverberate.
You don't really feel the echo.
You don't hear the echo.
Cause you, you have monitors on stage.
So it's coming to you pretty flat.
Okay.
But the noise of your voice where you've never heard your voice into a
microphone before ever.
Right.
And now you're in front of 16,000 people doing it.
And then Tony's sitting there looking at you and Shane's there and I'm there.
It's like a nightmare.
It's like you're, you're walking into a nightmare.
Well, what, just doing standup in front of like a guy like Shane Gillis is
crazy.
Crazy.
He's sitting right next to you.
You've never done standup.
You're going to do standup right next to a guy who's selling out arenas.
Like that's nuts.
Yeah.
That feeling is nuts.
But it's wonderful to watch because you're watching authentic reactions
happening in real time.
Yes.
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Yeah, it's true.
Yeah, it's just that we, I think human beings really love seeing what it's like
when someone starts out doing something.
Because a lot of people have these ideas like, "Ah, maybe I could try that," or
"Maybe I could learn how to play guitar. Maybe I could do that."
But it's just the getting going and sucking at something in the beginning is
terrifying for people.
So when they see someone just try it, I think they're like, "Oh, look at him go.
Look at him go. He's out there doing it. He's on the bike. He's moving."
You know, it's like you see actual people that are trying to do something that
they've never done before, and it's exciting.
And also, the one thing I wanted to touch on is the craft of it all, you know,
that it takes a lot of work.
I know that it's not, you know, just, you know, the writing, you know, she says
that one point, she's like, "You gotta write, you know, keep going up."
And I think most people, at least I didn't know before I started going, that
people go up three or four times a night.
Like I didn't understand. So that was something I thought it was important to
convey, just the work ethic that's needed.
Well, New York is really great for that. And it's always had a culture of that.
It's had a culture of guys hopping from club to club and doing set to set
because there's so many clubs in Manhattan.
So guys would just, you know, I think the most guy, I ever heard one guy did
eight, eight or nine sets a night.
Like, they're just like, that's how many clubs there are. So you just hop all
over the place. You start your night at like 8:00 PM.
Yeah, downtown. There's a ton downtown that you can go up to. Yeah. You can go
all over the place. It's, um, we've got a lot of that here now.
There's just so many clubs in Austin now. I mean, when we went there, what you
built is incredible.
Thank you. Culture, everything. You know, I showed the movie to a standup who
hadn't done standup in like 15 years.
And he said, "The only thing that for sure you got wrong is the culture." I was
like, "What do you mean?" He's like, "No, people aren't that nice."
And I was like, "Actually, I think you're wrong." I was like, "It's changed." I
was like, "People are supportive now."
It's in where you go. There's places where it's not very supportive.
Really? But at least like, I used to go to the cellar like in early 2000s. Didn't
feel like it does now.
Right. Well, I think Ari Shafir changed that a lot. He brought like the culture
of LA to New York where you're like more supportive of each other.
It was always like dog against dog because really the way it all started out
was in the 1990s, it was all about everyone was auditioning for a sitcom.
And if you and I were, if I showed up to audition for a sitcom, I'm like, "Oh
fuck, Bradley's here. He's going for the same part. Fuck that guy."
You know, it was like that could change your life. If you got that sitcom, now
all of a sudden you're fucking huge and I'm still like struggling to pay my
rent eating ramen and it could have been me.
Right. And so there's this like serious resentment that happens in the 1990s
because everybody, like the golden carrot at the end of the stick was The
Tonight Show.
Or, you know, hosting a late, if you could get your own late night show. Oh my
God, he made it. He's a host of The Tonight Show. That was like the thing that
only one person could get.
And then there was like the sitcom. Like if it really worked out, they'd make a
sitcom around you and you'd get a development deal. So there was, people would
psychologically backstab people.
People would talk shit to people before they went on stage. They would try to
hijack their fucking mind. Like really, it was dark.
Crazy.
And then the internet came around. And then the internet, instead of people
being your competitors, they became not just your friends and not just your
colleagues, but also an asset.
Because if you're doing a podcast and you've got your funny friends on, then
your podcast is better.
And then if you tell people about their podcast, and their podcast is better.
And then you go on their podcast and that's better. And everybody benefits from
everybody else doing well.
So it completely reversed the system. And then it became much more about being
supportive of each other. And then everybody kind of realized like, hey, it's
way more fun when we're all having fun, you know?
And since the television thing kind of died off, the sitcom thing kind of died
off with reality shows.
And then it was really just more about getting clips up on the internet and
about getting, and then there was Netflix specials. So it wasn't just everybody
trying to get an HBO special.
There was way more specials. And then you could just upload specials to YouTube
and became this way more collaborative, supportive environment.
And then Ari Shafir took that that we had kind of like established in LA and
brought that to New York. And a lot of those guys ran with it.
Yeah. I mean, that's the way to go. People always say, you know, there's a lot
of room at the top.
Yeah.
There's a lot.
There's a lot of room and stand up for sure, you know, and it's like, and
everybody has their own lane, even within this big highway and everybody wants
to be with other people who wants to be a lone wolf really for a long period.
For a long period of time.
Yeah.
There's a few. There's a few out there, but they're all psychologically
destroyed. They're just a mess.
Yeah.
Who doesn't want to have friends? It's crazy.
Yeah.
I don't get it. But, you know, it's that aspect of the culture I felt like in
the movie you guys nailed, which is a realistic aspect.
Good.
A realistic portrayal of what it's like where a bunch of people just, they were
all busting each other's balls.
Yeah. Oh yeah. Exactly. You could be supportive and still honest. That was the
thing. There's no lack of honesty or criticism. It's just, it's not done with
the hope that you, your demise, for your demise.
Yes.
That's the difference.
Yeah. I think the nineties like poisoned a lot of comedians. It poisoned them
because it gave you this idea that the whole thing was about a means to an end.
And that end was a sitcom. And everybody thought you just had to get a sitcom,
gotta get a sitcom. And that was what everybody was working towards.
There's people that were developing their entire act based around a, around a
persona that they could sell to the networks.
Were you doing standup before, uh, your sitcom?
Yes.
I see. Okay. So is that how that happened? Did someone see you and then they
were like, Oh, you gotta, you gotta try this show?
Yeah, I got, I got ridiculously lucky. Like, you know, a lot of people say, Oh,
I work really hard to get on a sitcom. Nope. No, I got lucky. I did the MTV. I
never had any aspirations to act at all.
I did MTV half hour comedy hour. I got a development deal. And all of a sudden
I'm in living in LA and I'm on a sitcom and it happened in a couple of months.
It's been a great sitcom.
I was on a bad one first. I was on a bad one called Hardball. It was a sitcom
on Fox where I played a baseball player. That show got canceled. And
unfortunately I thought it was going to go because I was retarded. I was, you
know, 25 years old, 26 years old. And I was like, Oh, this is going to take off.
I should get an apartment. So I had a lease on an apartment and I wanted to
move.
By the way, everybody, I'm sure people were telling you that it was going to
take off too.
Oh yeah. Everybody believed it. Yeah. You're going to win an Emmy. Well, the
guys who made it, uh, Jeff Martin and Kevin Curran, they worked on the Simpsons.
They worked on married with children. They were really good.
Oh wow. But then the Fox people came in and just ruined it. Like the executives
came in and they brought in a bunch of hacks and just ruined the show.
Did you have fun doing it?
Oh yeah. I had a, I had a kind of good time, but I also missed comedy and I
missed New York people and I wanted to get out of there. I was like, I got to
get back to New York. Fuck this place.
As soon as it was over, but I was like, fuck, I got this lease. So I had a
lease for a year and then I got a development deal.
So how long were you in LA at that time?
Oh, I was only in LA for a few months.
Wow.
Yeah. So I moved out there to do the show.
Right.
I got a lease like almost immediately. And then I was out there for a few
months, show get canceled. And then, um, I got a development deal to do
something for NBC and they were going to do my own sitcom.
And, but as we were developing it, they said, Hey, there's a show that we're
doing. It's called news radio. It's already been picked up.
We already did the pilot, uh, but we fired one P one person from the pilot and
we want you to read for this. And that's how I got on news radio. That's how it
happened.
Like that was the only second show I ever auditioned for ever.
Wow.
So I had one show, one on air and got canceled.
You had a very unique track.
Dumb luck.
That's nuts.
Stumbled into it a hundred percent. I can't take any credit for it. Dumb luck.
That's amazing.
Just my ability to keep it together in auditions and not crack with no acting
experience at all.
But it was just not, it wasn't something that I aspired to. So it didn't have
the kind of pressure that it probably had for a lot of people.
And it probably didn't have the same kind of elation too.
Like you put, I assume if it's not something you really wanted, it was like, it
was fun, but you weren't like, this is, uh, this is like, this feels right.
No, what it felt like is, Ooh, I'm going to get money.
Yeah.
Get some money.
Yeah.
Then something's wrong.
Something's wrong.
I was like, this is good.
I'm going to get money and I don't have to worry about money.
That's how I thought about it.
Right.
And then when I was doing it, I was like, wow, I'm so lucky. Like, how did I
stumble on, I'm here with Phil Hartman. This is crazy.
Yeah, it's crazy, dude.
Dave Foley and Steven Root.
It's crazy.
Mora Tierney, like this is nuts.
Yeah.
It was a crazy cast.
And Sorkin wrote it, right?
It was Paul Sims.
Paul Sims.
Right.
Yeah.
Who had just left Larry Sanders show.
Right.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah.
It was crazy luck.
Just stupid, dumb luck.
That's right.
Sorkin did that other show with Jeff Daniels.
Right.
Yeah.
It was, it was a lot of fun.
Um, so, but, but back in those days, like everybody was working towards that.
And fortunately I already had that.
So my thing was just like, continue to work on standup and just work on my
standup.
If this all goes away, I'll just go back to being a comic.
And doing standup in LA.
Yes.
Right.
So, and so that was new.
That's.
Yeah.
And that's where I encountered like the worst backstabbing I've ever seen in my
life.
So you're coming from New York where you didn't feel that.
You didn't feel it as much.
Right.
You know, you felt like a lot of shit talking, but that was fun.
You know, the guys would make fun if you bombed.
Right.
They were doing it to your face.
Yeah.
They were doing it to your face.
And it was a more like, it was just a more ball busting, like silly environment.
Right.
In New York.
It wasn't.
No one thought they were going to get famous in New York.
You know, they were all just.
Right.
Just doing sets.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But in LA, everybody had this idea to get a sitcom.
And then in the 1990s, they started giving out development deals.
That was the big thing.
You get like a 200,000, half a million dollar development deal.
And then all of a sudden you have all this money and you're living it.
And so everybody was working towards that.
So it became, instead of like people working towards just being a standup, it
became standup
was a means to an end.
And then all these other people, they were in your way to get that goal.
Jesus.
And then your agent was telling you that's what you had to do.
Right.
Because they wanted that money too.
Right.
So it was all like programming people to go after the sitcom.
So completely different culture in the standup community there.
Exactly.
But then that all went away.
It all went away.
Like this, the idea of working towards a sitcom is not, it's like working
towards a career
in ham radio.
Right.
Like it's fucking went away.
Well, you say that Ari changed it.
How did he do it?
Because he brought the LA culture to New York.
Ari moved from LA back to New York.
And he, I mean, everybody that I talked to in New York is always like, you guys
are doing
it wrong.
And people listened to him.
Yeah.
Well, because he was established and he was a really good comic.
And they were like, okay, I think he's right.
Wow.
And they would come to, they would come to LA.
Like a lot of guys like Andrew Schultz and a lot of these other guys, they
would come
to LA and they're like, bro, everybody's so fucking nice here.
And they're all just having a great time.
Like, why aren't we doing that?
Why aren't we just having a great time?
And so it shifted.
It's just, it was the culture of the internet.
The internet changed everything because there was no longer this one thing that
a hundred guys
were trying to audition for.
Now it was anybody could just put up something online and then all your friends
became assets.
They all became like valuable to you instead of competitors.
That's cool.
Yeah.
Do you go up in these cities ever now?
I do.
If I'm in LA, I'll still do sets in LA.
I haven't been in a while, but you know, most of the time I'm at my own club.
Right.
So I have teenage kids and they're, I want to be home.
Did you do the cellar?
Yeah, I did the cellar back in the day.
But more I did, I did the stand.
I did, um, catch when it was there.
Right.
I did, um, uh, I always did danger fields.
Danger fields was great because it was like a hole in the wall.
There was hardly anybody there.
Is that where he shot his special?
Yes.
Wow.
Yeah.
It was big in the eighties and then something happened.
And by the time I got there in the nineties, it was like fucking dead.
One time I went there and I had a spot at like, um, 8:30.
And I don't remember what time the show started, but there was a few people on
before me.
And I got there and the people that were on before me were sitting at the bar.
I go, what's going on?
There's no crowd.
Like, there's no crowd.
There's nobody.
And so then this couple walked up and, uh, they bought tickets for the comedy
show.
And this guy, Bobby, who was the doorman, like step right up.
It was a Scottish guy.
Come on in.
I have you seated.
He seats them down.
There's no one there.
Just them.
They sit down.
Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to danger fields.
Your first act.
And we all did stand up for two fucking people.
Wow.
Yeah.
The whole night was two people.
And they had a great time.
I'm sure.
But it was weird.
It's like when you're doing stand up for just two people.
You're only looking at two people.
But you also realize how much of your act is bullshit.
How much of your act is like fucking dance moves.
It's just nonsense.
Like English on the cue ball.
It's like you're doing a lot of silly things that like don't even.
And you're not connecting with real humans.
Right.
And when there's two people there, it like cuts the fat out of all of your shit.
And you recognize where the flaws in your writing are and the flaws in your
delivery.
But danger fields was, it was a wild little place.
It was, it was like a classic comedy club that didn't have any, no industry
went there.
No agents, no managers went there.
Wow.
Always.
Yeah.
It was just like a bunch of weird degenerates and it was fun.
Wow.
That was a fun place.
So I did that club a lot.
But a lot of, I did the road a lot.
Yeah.
Because that was how I could make money.
And I could headline.
I could do an hour.
Because if you're in the city, you're doing 15 minute sets or 10 minute sets.
And that's great.
But it's hard to piece together an hour at a 10 minute sets.
Because you kind of want to let the material breathe and put it all together.
Yeah, of course.
And compose it into one big thing.
And you really can work on that a lot more if you're actually headlining.
Do you watch a lot of specials, comedy specials nowadays?
I don't.
I watch a lot of comics, like when I see them at the club.
Live.
Right.
But not like...
No, I probably should.
I probably should watch more of them.
But really comedy is, it's like an artistic form of hypnosis.
And the real way to see comedy is to be there live.
Right.
Because you're like...
And you know when the person's locked in and you know when they're not.
You feel it.
They got you.
Like they're thinking for you.
Yeah.
Like if I'm watching a tell and he's at like the mothership and he's killing.
Like we're all like this.
We're like locked into his brain.
And we're letting him like take us on a ride.
Yeah, of course.
It's like a kind of a form of hypnosis.
Yes.
And I really think that a stand-up special, as good as they are, you're maybe
getting 60
to 70 percent of the experience of actually being there.
That's why I enjoy watching to see how different people make them.
Mm.
Because there's all different types.
Yeah.
You know, some are heavily edited, which always brings me out if there's a way
to keep it
so you feel like you're in the room.
Right.
You know, I remember it was a Mr. Tambourine Man or the Chris Rock special
where when he
changed the tone of it and he started talking about jerking off to porn and how
he became addicted
to porn.
And it was that great filmmaker who's a comedian who does music.
He did that thing during COVID when he was in his house.
Bo Burnham.
Bo Burnham.
Bo Burnham.
I think he directed it.
Oh, really?
And the camera just keeps going on, keeps going on.
By the time you don't even realize it because you're hypnotized, you're right
here on Chris
Rock.
And I think probably subconsciously just thinking about it now, that's probably
one of the things,
because that's kind of the frame I used the whole time on Alex on Will.
Yeah.
But I remember watching it going like, when the fuck did this become a close up?
You know?
But that's what it was happening.
Right.
So there was a synergy between the camera and what he was doing in the place.
Right.
And I didn't feel like, cinematically, I was there and this is what he was
doing, hypnotizing
me.
Right.
And then the opposite of that was the special that Chris Rock did where he
changed clothes.
Mmm.
So he was doing a special where he filmed part of it in one place and another
part of it
in another place.
And he spliced the two of them together with different outfits.
Mmm.
So you would have him begin a bit with one outfit on and then end a bit with a
different outfit
on.
And you're like, whose idea was this?
Yeah.
Because the minute you cut and edit in any way, you know, even podcasts audio
wise, that's
the thing I've learned.
You know, some people, you know, they edit the audio of a podcast and you're
like, that's
not, someone didn't take a breath before they answered.
Oh, like cutting out in between.
Yeah.
It's a whole other rhythm.
Right.
Well, that's the YouTube thing, right?
The YouTube for a long time was doing these things where they would cut out all
the pauses
in between people talking things and it became like a style of editing.
Right.
Where it's like shocking.
But the idea is-
For my ears, like, it's impossible for me to get in.
Right.
It's just impossible.
Well, it's the short attention span concept.
Right.
You're just saying people are so fucking stupid, you can't give them any breaks.
You can't give them any breath.
You got to keep talking, keep talking, keep talking.
And then, you know, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah.
And it's like, it's exhausting.
After a while, it's just like this wash and yeah.
Yeah.
They're just trying to keep you engaged as much as possible by editing instead
of by having actually
interesting content.
Compelling content.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It's an interesting exercise.
Yeah.
I enjoy watching, like I think Josh Safdie did Sandler's one and he did all
this backstage
and he walked up and then he was in many locations, but he was playing music a
lot.
Yeah.
I just like watching everybody's different, you know, sort of exploration of
different stand-up
shows.
Cause it's such a huge viable market.
So people, you know, it's, it's fun to watch how they do it.
I think that's probably why, cause I watched so many of them.
I wanted to do it in a way in a movie.
Have you done stand-up at all?
Never, never, never.
Never?
No.
Have you thought about it?
No.
When you were doing the film, did you think about doing it?
No, no.
No?
Yeah.
And I don't know why, Joe.
Yeah.
But no, I just, it's not like one of those things that I feel, um, compelled to
do.
But would it, would it be fun?
Would I be scared?
All those things.
Um, will I try and open mic one night?
Yeah, I probably should.
Um, but it's not, I didn't feel compelled to do it.
No.
The problem would be if you did it and it went okay, but you're like, I think I
could
do better.
And then I'm-
And then you're gone.
You know me?
I know everybody.
It's kind of the same thing with all of us.
Yeah, of course, dude.
There's always a part of you like, I think I can do better.
Yeah.
And then next thing you know, like, I gotta leave.
I gotta go do a set.
Right.
What the fuck are you doing?
Dad, I haven't eaten dinner.
No, no, no, no, no.
It's like all artistic pursuits, they can become an obsession and they become
an addiction
and they become a part of you.
And then it's like your brain naturally goes towards that pathway of thinking
about that thing
all day.
Yeah, which I love.
Oh, it's great if it's a fun thing.
I remember being 11 and watching The Elephant Man and knowing at that moment,
you okay?
Yeah, I'm sweating.
Yeah.
Knowing at that moment that like, oh, this is what I want to do for the rest of
my life.
When you saw The Elephant Man?
Yeah.
Really?
Yeah, I remember.
Why was it that movie?
I mean, I don't know.
I mean, I've thought about it a lot, obviously.
David Lynch directed it.
I remember the scene, Anthony Hopkins.
I loved film.
So I always loved film.
My dad loved film.
But it wasn't like a conscious thing where I was like, this is it.
And I remember, you know, in my living room, it's on the TV.
I saw all the movies on the TV.
You know, I never saw Apocalypse Now in a movie theater or Godfather or
anything.
Right.
The Loneliness is the Longest Runner or, you know, none of it.
It was all on the television.
But I was watching The Elephant Man.
It was on HBO.
It came through Philadelphia where I live, Comcast.
And they would show, like, it all the time.
And it was Anthony Hopkins coming in.
And he's seeing Joseph Merrick, The Elephant Man, for the first time.
And the way David Lynch shot it, you only see his shadow.
And then Hopkins starts crying.
And I don't know.
I was just like, I was there in that cellar with him.
And I was like, I forgot I was in the living room.
And then the whole movie was like that.
And it came out.
I was like, I just want that.
So was that, like, the first seed that was planted?
Yeah, that was it.
How old were you?
Only.
I was 11.
Wow.
It was like, bam.
It was like a shot.
There's a scene right here.
Yeah, it's right.
It's this.
This is it.
Oh, look how young Anthony Hopkins looks.
Yeah, he was incredible.
Stand up.
Stand up!
Turn around.
Turn around!
Turn around.
Turn around!
Turn around!
wow wow that was it yeah wow what is it like watching that now like yeah
thinking that that
planted a seed that changed your whole life i'm like well first i thought wasn't
it a shadow but
that was before and then i'm like oh yeah and then yeah then i was just in it
then all of a sudden i
was there then i was like is joe in it does he know what i'm talking about and
then i was and
then as my brain started going the movie kept bringing me in it yeah and then
by the end by
that push-in i was like i'm just watching this guy look at this thing for the
first time and then
fuck look at this beast anthony hopkins i wonder what he was looking at when he
was crying i know
you know because you know pull that out of your eyeballs oh dude and i wrote so
i went to grad
school moved to new york wrote him a letter because our dean said somehow he
knew him or he had i the
the school i went to that i only got into because they let anybody in
um they did that show inside the actor's studio do you remember that on tv on
bravo do you remember
that yeah and so our thesis was the show there was like our art not like our
there was a class that
but it was a class like technically a class and so all these incredible people
would come on and
anthony hopkins was there and and i was there for that and then i wrote him a
letter just telling him
and i asked uh james lipton that was his name the dean yeah and uh and then you
know and then never you
know i never heard from him ever and then um you know and now i know him dude
do you know how weird
it's crazy it's so weird right i never get over that me neither meeting ever
ever and there's some
guys i don't know if you feel this way too but like there's some guys like then
they become your
friends but still i still feel a little bit of like extra energy when i'm
around them like it'll
never go away right yeah for sure it's crazy for me one of the big ones was tarantino
like oh
hanging out with tarantino yeah that would be nuts it's so odd going to dinner
with him yeah it's
crazy hanging out with him here him coming to the club he come hang out hang
out in the green room
it's nuts it's just weird it's like that's quentin tarantino yeah that's great
yeah and it never
goes away as close as you get and even when your brain's off right because that's
always the litmus
is my brain off when i'm with the person right that's like when like okay right
and even like
clint eastwood who i did american sniper with i mean it was always clint eastwood
and i got to a point
where my brain was off you know but still i'm just like what if my dad was
alive if my dad was
he would flip the fuck out what was it like doing that scene with the fake baby
was that weird it's
so funny i was just talking about that two days ago dude and you know i've come
full circle i actually
think it's dope really i think it's fucking why because it's so just like wow
look at these people
fully invested and it's a doll
it's like a scene where you're like kind of like moving the hand a little bit
with your finger i could
tell you the whole thing dude so we had three sets of uh twins and uh clint
likes to shoot fast which i
loved and love and they were crying and they weren't ready and he was like you
know what let's just uh
let's put let's put the doll in and i was like okay i was like all right and
and and i had the doll and
i remember and i made a joke on set and i was like i was like uh i'll just save
you 35 grand because i
moved his his uh his hand with my thumb yeah you know like i saved visual
effects like 50 grand
like made a joke about it and then we got to post and we were in vancouver uh
at the doing the
meeting but you know everybody defers to the boss i still remember being in a
room and i'm like a
theater we're watching and they're like okay clint so we did this and uh you
know the tank has dirt on
it and you know whatever visual effects they had done we get to the baby i'm
like okay clint this is
uh this scene and it ends and i'm literally behind clint i just see the back of
his head and i'm waiting
for everybody to raise their hand like we got to spend more money and make the
kid real and uh i think
the kid had like two fingers too like they weren't even it was like an a yeah
that's it yeah that's it
but dude it's kind of dope i love it now i've come full circle so so and i
raised my hand
and i was like clint i just think that it's clear you know that that's not a
baby and what would do we
can we at least just find out what the cost would be and no one and no one said
anything and then i
remember he was like i think i think we move on wow and that was it dude and
that was it and i was
like okay okay and i remember talking to the other producer i was like this is
gonna come back
i was like bro this is gonna come back to haunt us and i remember he said no bradley
you're too
close to the movie i was like i don't think so dude no everybody's like he's
moving his thumb
this is crazy that's a rubber baby crazy dude there's another one too and like
yeah yeah yeah
it's crazy what is it like doing a film like that where you're playing an
actual human being
is that is that different than a like a written character that has no physical
body that you you
you can kind of become who you think the words represent yeah but when you're
playing a guy like
chris kyle you're you're playing a human yeah and you're trying to figure out a
way to make it as
realistic as possible but you're acting like what is that like i mean the thing
that just popped my
head is the pressure is is it's like night and day because there are people
that you have to um
serve you know especially with chris kyle we started making that movie he was
alive he got killed while
we were he was still negotiating with warner brother i know i think he we just
closed his deal
and then he was murdered on february 2nd i believe and uh and it was just like
whoa and um and then but
in fact we were like now we really got to make this movie and um and then clint
and i flew to
midlothian texas and met with his family and his widow and his parents and then
the kids and
i had played i did the elephant man i did it as a play in my thesis in grad
school and then i did it
at williamstown and i actually did it in new york and london so and that and
even though it's a long
time ago that was the first time i felt that responsibility because i actually
loved that guy
joseph merrick and i did and i felt that responsibility to him so i had done
something like
that before but this was the first this was the next time it was massive joe
but i think that that
it's like you're always looking for what's the fuel that's gonna allow me to
work as hard as i can
and the fuel when you're playing a real person is like there's like four extra
canisters or like
vats of firepower for you to work hard because you just you know you're looking
across the eyes of
somebody say i'm gonna serve your son or your husband or your father it's a
major responsibility
maybe even more major because he's now he's deceased yeah it is it was it was
mind-blowing
um but and it terrified me and also like i'm 185 pounds at that point from
northeast philadelphia
this guy's from midlothian texas seal team three you know it's like how and and
the way clint works
the way we did work you know uh kevin lace who was a seal team three with chris
was in the movie
played dauber jacob schick it was one tribe which is what i'm wearing he was a
marine that did you
ever see american sniper yes yeah there's that scene where he goes to the
hospital there's all the guys
have been wounded jacob schick is one of them you know so there's real guys it's
all real so i step in
you know i've got to i i'm gonna die unless i believe i'm chris right like so i
have to do
whatever i can so that i believe i'm chris if i believe i'm chris then i have a
shot at everybody
else potentially going along with this illusion i just have to i have to be
absolutely fearless when
i walked on set so i just it just made me work so hard that i'd never worked
hard that if it's a
created character you know it's it's different but it comes with a different
set of challenges
you know it depends it just depends on what it is but i do know and then with
leonard bernstein he
did the same thing huge responsibility like massive that i felt right to his
kids right right to people
that loved him um but but mainly his kids all three his son has passed away
since it but his three kids
are like okay you know they're like handing you you know it's like if someone
went to your daughter
in 12 years and said here's this movie about your father do you know what i
mean yeah you know yeah
and and this guy's sitting across and be like okay i'm gonna play your father
that's just a whole other
thing because the truth is like if it's good it's gonna last a long time and it's
gonna be a thing
that marks their journey so i'm a part of whatever little part of chris's
journey so you give somebody
you the faith that whoever has the power to give to that artist is just you
know so it just made me
work you know like you just you just don't stop working till you get to the
point where you believe
you're him or you believe that he's a part of you something's working did you
meet chris kyle never
just talked to him on the phone once oh wow yeah so what did you like what did
you train
oh yeah what did you do to try to like yeah well here's it's interesting right
it's like well i
couldn't do anything that would ever achieve what he achieved but it's like
what can i do
to look like a master right so there's three weapons the 338 lapua the 50 cal
the uh the uh rifle
it's like what can i do how much time do i have i think i had like six months
also luckily we're the same shoe size same age he has a hole in his ear i do
you find things that
like you know uh same height i was like oh this is great uh and then i just
like but he's 238
pounds so the first thing was 6 000 calories a day found a trainer and just
thousand yeah six thousand
calories first i did it with real food and that was a big mistake because i
couldn't get up i
remember the first week i did it had an incredible chef and and and then i
would i couldn't get up
like i couldn't move like i couldn't move my stomach so then we i think we
split like half of it into
protein shakes but it was still 6 000 when you say you couldn't get up like
what do you mean my stomach
wasn't able to process that much food yeah whatever whatever happened i could
just getting blocked
getting blocked like major pain like i was giving birth or something what i
would imagine
so then we change it and it would be like huge meal shake huge meal shake
worked out twice a day
five i had three rest days no cardio it was all about strength training like
and then and it was
all focused around dead lifting oh okay and uh it was guy jason walsh who i
worked with and um and i did
that yes it would be like monday to monday 5 30 a.m and then a 4 30 p.m or like
3 30 monday tuesday
rest wednesday thursday friday rest saturday sunday and did that and i got up
to 238 pounds and a lot
of it was like because i was thinking about him his neck and he might so i came
like i would do all these
all the neck stuff and it was his shoulders like i just wanted so you could
shoot over and it's like
you know which we did all the time in the movie where the guy's just you know
chris yeah nfl playoffs
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gaming resources cdkng.co slash audio limited time offer um how much weight did
you gain i went from
185 to 238 whoa yeah and all naturally because i have cancers in my family i've
had skin cancer and
like i'm terrified of anything so i was like not going to do that um so you
know you did creatine or
anything to creatine yeah which by the way i just started again like three
months ago oh it's amazing
dude i'm on this push-up thread with a bunch of dads at my school and we do 100
push-ups a day
and if we don't you have to pay 10 into a pool and then when we get to 800 we
go to chinatown and i'll
have a meal with the money and then i started taking creatine like two and a
half months ago and uh we
just upped it to 150 i was like this is because i could only do and we'd like
youtube the perfect
push-up which i didn't know which is like a whole other world uh and then now
it's it's i mean
creatine is incredible it's incredible for your brain i know i've i've heard
you say that like i can't
tell that because i also take zins all the time so it's like i don't know what's
doing it
yeah me too i do the same thing um but but um yeah where was i on the chris
thing you're talking
about gaining weight oh yeah oh yeah so then i worked with this and i worked
with the guy who so i was
doing that in conjunction with um learning about sniping and uh working with kevin
lace this guy
dauber we would go up to the disney ranch and work with like 600 yard head
targets prone that i would
just do all the time and then we then once we cast the rest of the team we did
all this stuff but really
kevin lace this guy dauber was the guy because he was there and he was there
through the whole shooting
just so everything would be real and we just drilled it we became a group like
you know we did the work
but it wasn't so much about like i was like i have this amount of time doing
like seal boot camp will
do nothing for me like like that that'll just give me the brain like how hard
this is and will i be
broken i've done this not that i couldn't have not maybe i would have been
broken but i felt like i do
understand that like i've been through certain things where like i understand
what it's like to push
myself to be on my breaking point and what that looks like and feels like what
i don't know
is when i'm looking at a target and i have to factor in that you know the curve
of the earth
you know like that's the stuff i want to learn yeah um so that's where i focus
was those three
weapons you know live rounds gaining the weight so i felt like i was here we go
we're back um
that's like all of a sudden you're like oh you didn't take the drug
um like no i'm not on it um and then and then so it was those two things in
conjunction the curve
of the earth is nuts yeah i think about that it's crazy long distance and then
the fact that these
guys stayed up 24 hours would pee in there you know never get up to pee just
pee right there
right in the room you know i mean i said no and then by the way it's a human
being i mean it's just
yeah forget it um and then just working with this guy tim monica on like his
voice to me it's all
the voice is everything it's all about the voice and like where he's from and
chris was interesting
because his accent started to change you know because he once he got out and
then he did that um
he did a couple of shows you know he wrote that book which is how i came across
and then gave it to
glint um so he had an interesting accent that kind of changed a little bit um
but yeah just the
voice just hitting the voice i would work this guy five days a week you know
you know and i had tons
of stuff i had so much information that teya kyle had been so generous to give
me so many home videos
you know correspondence you know i i used to work out to his which i just did
the other day hadn't it's
so funny we're talking about this i literally just did it two days ago um
worked out to his playlist
i had both of his uh workout playlists oh wow and i and i and i blew up two
huge posters and one was
him just like this and one with his gun and i would do that and look at him
every morning it was just
like this beautiful ritual that i felt like i was with him every day how long
did you take to prepare
i i'd have to look back i think i i did it fast but i think we had about six
months or five months
but like you know full-on that's it nothing else i didn't have a kid back then
it was like that was it
yeah yeah that's there's there's something very unique about someone doing a
film about an actual
person yeah like a great actor doing like de niro when he played uh jake lamotta
yeah raging bull of
course like that that was one of the first i mean he became a different person
yeah yeah you have to
yeah you have to if there's like a merging of you and that whatever that idea
or the soul whatever of
the person it sounds so hokey you know i get it but if you ask me what my
memory is of of making a
sniper like memory like on in scenes it's not that like uh i was acting it's
just that's not my memory
what is the memory of like okay now we're gonna do this and it's like me as him
doing it wow you know
that's that was that a mind when you stop when like the movie well the good
thing is you do a
clint who takes the piss out of everything oh does he so yeah so we would go to
dinner at night
and uh and i learned from christian bale in american hustle like he just stayed
in because i didn't
understand this stay in the character all the time you know you hear these
stories but you don't know
what the real is like how does that work you see a cell phone do you like lose
your mind like how do you
what is it how do you do it and it's like oh i overthought it bale would just
stay he was played this
character that's from new york in in american hustle and i'd go in there the
first day i met him he was
his accent and the rest the movie even like on weekends it was it was him
christian and i could
we would talk about stuff and his kid but he would just speak in that voice and
i was like oh it's that
simple like it's not some big thing like once you get the voice that is weird
you know but i took it
i mean and it's wonderful because then you feel like you're not acting and you're
in the voice and i do it
all like so so i would be in that voice of chris for the whole movie and then
we would go to like
a restaurant when we were like up in lancaster shooting or something and clint
would then make
fun of me in my accent as chris and order a steak and it was just it was it was
great yeah he's
fucking sabotaging your performance he's making you self-conscious that's crazy
it was awesome that's
crazy i always wondered what it's like to be around someone is like method
whether i don't know that's
i wouldn't you know method is also a term that you know what does it mean well
the method well
what happened it started in russia right and then uh um you know that book uh
on acting that i should
know um you know what's his name he came and then the group theater started it
was like you know and
all these people then disbanded and there's harry meisner and there's yes stanislavski
exactly and
there was this other guy vok tangoff that also talked about uh that every
rehearsal it's very
interesting and i read all this in grad school and then the group theater came
in and then ilia kazan
was a huge part of it becoming popular because you had this guy that was
sweeping floors of the actor
studio and then started directing plays and then all of a sudden he's a huge
movie director and he's
putting marlon brando who's part of the actor studio starring in his movies you
know and and he's
doing and so it all just sort of erupted but then it branched out and so there's
people that are
dogmatic about it about it's only using your you know you're substituting so if
i'm doing a scene
with you like you aren't you you're my brother you know right but but but it's
evolved into it's like
what works for you to me it's like you use your your own experience plus your
imagination
you know but that's that's the sort that's the you know sort of a very layman's
50 second uh
you know telling of what the origin of the method is but i went to the actor
studio which is based in the
method that's where i went to grad school um is it and it's very valuable
because i didn't know
before that i mean i did a couple of plays at georgetown i didn't know anything
i mean i just
loved acting but i didn't do anything about it i was terrified as a kid like we
did this thing in
high school where we had to as seniors we would put on our show where we would
make fun of our teachers
and i like i could do my latin teacher mr burke i was like and i actually sang
in it we sang and i was
like but i was terrified joe for the whole year sleepless nights for a year
leading up to it
that's how scared i was in public i remember doing like a fifth grade
presentation with the poster
boards about lock and hobbs and the poster shaking so hard because i was
because i was so nervous i was
like how am i gonna what's this fear thing isn't that weird i know but then in
college i did a couple
of plays but i still didn't know what i was doing but i loved it and i was like
little stuff i was like
asalan the server in dangerous liaisons but i still remember like i closed the
door in a rhythm rhythmic
way and people laughed and i remember i was like oh oh this feels good and then
and then so i applied
to grad school there and then all of a sudden it was like i got a huge
foundation of like what i could
do you know that your insecurities are actually your attributes your fears or
stuff that you know all this
thing that you're a sensitive kid this is all good stuff and i never felt that
way before about any of
that and i had this teacher elizabeth kemp who was incredible who then passed
away in my house years
later she got sick yeah it's crazy passed away in your house yeah in venice california
she was six so
we put her hospice there but um she was incredible and she did this basic
technique class and it was the
first time ever because i didn't you know grow up therapy or and none of that
was even you know in
the vicinity of talking about your feelings you know my i loved my dad but i
grew up in you know the 80s
in northeast philadelphia with an irish italian upbringing that wasn't part of
the deal and um
and then all of a sudden in grad school with other guys and women and we're
like laying down and
she wants us to go through an experience of loss and betrayal when we were
children it's like what
the fuck and actually i could take all that stuff i've been ashamed of and i
could use it and bring it
into art i don't know really clicked with me in a huge way um so and i use it
even to this day all
the movies i do i always get the actors together and do like a workshop for a
week that's based on
dreams that she also taught me and i just find it invaluable any way you can
just how can i just get
to a place where we're just talking to each other and i don't you know what
could and then all this
stuff i feel it's okay right right yeah when you're doing a guy like chris it
must also be kind of
easier to keep the accent than to try to re-establish it right before every
scene you just said it
it's a logical thing yeah that's it it's a logical thing the idea of me talking
with an accent or even
thinking that it's an accent because you don't think about it anymore the whole
point is i'm not
doing an act if i'm doing a scene with you and i'm thinking about how i'm
talking it's over it's
a wrap right it's not real right but if i'm just talking to you and it happens
to be the voice that
i've been working on for however long time then we're in it we got a shot yeah
and if i'm stopping
it there's no way i'm not thinking about so yes joe that is the reason you know
what's a really
underappreciated talent is voice actors who do audiobooks i was watching a
video of this guy
because i never knew how they did it and i kind of assumed that whenever they
had to change accents
they probably had a pause where they were but there's like there's a video of a
guy doing the
voiceover for lord of the rings the lord of the rings audiobook and he goes
into smeagol he goes into
the golem character while he's doing narration there's no break he just
smoothly transitions
it's incredible it's nuts it is absolutely masterful and completely underappreciated
yeah i agree with
you because if you watch this guy do it i i don't know the gentleman's name who's
the voiceover actor
but i love audiobooks this that guy listen to this guy oh it's andy circus
holding a debate with some
other thought that used the same voice but made it squeak and hiss a pale light
and a green light
alternated in his eyes as he spoke
and you're talking about a master actor yes yeah you know because he's been in
a lot of movies he's
directed he directed that great movie uh that was like uh jungle book a version
of jungle book that
christian bale actually played the panther i believe he's incredible and i got
to meet him he he's like
this guy's like a one-off generational talent yeah he's insane you have to be
yeah to be that good at
voiceover yeah and he's just a great actor yeah you have to be yeah yeah i i
agree and my mother watches
this uh she'll kill me that i'm saying my mother watches first of all she loves
turkish uh soap operas
so she watches everything turkish oh yeah yeah yeah why them specifically i don't
know she just she
she graduated from hallmark into turkish
channel and uh and then she's evolved even further she just watches the screens
where there's two people ai images and it's just a person telling a story and i
often i'll come down
making breakfast because when she stays with me in new york she has the room
down there and i'll be like
making my daughter breakfast and i could hear it or i'll go to the bathroom
which is right next to her
and i was like wow these guys these voices i mean the guy's carrying it all it's
just an image
and she'll watch it for hours and i'm like what's gonna happen is he gonna make
that is the firm gonna
hire him is she gonna did she see the note like he's it's amazing i was like
yeah it's really an art form
turkish yeah i remember the first time i came down i was like oh no what
happened because i'm just
hearing i'm like what happened and i walk in and i'm like mom what are you what
are you watching
she's like oh no this guy's the best actor in the world this guy and so she
just reads the
subtitles yeah she did it for like she's watching it's called um uh if you look
up uh
he's like what's it called circle uh is it dove bird bird something
how could i forget it oh baby is that it early bird
early bird oh yeah oh yeah explain this so it's a soap it's a soap opera there's
like 360 episodes
she's watched them all like five four times and she'll come in she'll like do a
marathon session
come in to make some food she's like this guy just the way he moves this guy's
the best actor
that's that's him that's him that's him yeah that's him is it speaking in turkish
oh yeah yeah oh yeah
here's some of this this looks like um yeah that's it yeah there he is
yeah there he is and so she likes this and she does the voiceover she reads the
no so that's that's that was the middle stage now she's graduated to it's
different now where she just
watches two ai images and it's a story but she did this for a good like eight
years but why was she into
this i don't know she must have come across it one day on somewhere and then
that was it she just got
hooked oh i mean hooked isn't even the word yeah by the way it's pretty good is
it yeah yeah you watch
it yeah yeah yeah he's great and the other woman in it's great too yeah do you
consume a lot of films
do you watch i watch a lot of everything yeah i love television uh films and
then you know like eight
months ago i i know i'm late to the game came across across podcasts only eight
months ago yeah pretty much
yeah yeah that's interesting isn't it yeah yeah what what made you get into
that
i can't remember but it was your podcast and i'm trying to think what it was
and then and then it was like oh and then i came and then you know once you
watch something on your
phone it like suggests other things and uh and then you had two guys on that i
thought really
interesting and then they do a trigonometry yeah and then i find that very
fascinating oh they're
great yeah great and so that's how it just started so now it's like a huge part
of like i have this
whole little thing like like often i'll go to bed and my daughter's listening
to your voice
but i do put on headphones sometimes because i love like just at the end of the
day listening
listening or watching i'll put it on the side table yeah it's very podcasts are
incredible it's very
soothing very soothing that's interesting i hardly ever listen to them anymore
i love i love tv i love it yeah i
i take in a lot of content have you watched the beast in me on netflix i did oh
dude holy
shit dude dude and that guy um carrie russell's husband matthew reese dude the
the bad guy yeah
how good is that guy so i did a movie with him years ago called burnt about a
chef and we had never met
and there's a scene where my character he was trying to get sober and he's he
went off the wagon and he goes
and that this guy their old nemesis they were nemesis with each other his
restaurant after hours
and um it was like a pretty dark scene that we never met me and this guy this
actor right before
we shot and i come in and then i don't know what was i was pretty it was i was
pretty locked in
and there's one scene which wasn't really scripted and i took you know those
sous vide bags
and i put it over my head to try to because he's trying to kill himself which
by the way i was like
oh this this could work if i don't get help those things are strong and tight
and then we had this
experience joe where then he was ripping it off me trying to for me not to kill
myself and i don't
know him that well but we had that's the thing about like making art together
like we had that it'll never
every time i see him i've seen him maybe six times of like certain things or
something i always feel
like we're bonded forever just based on this one experience that we had and he's
an incredible actor
he's just and he and i the end of that show him in the end oh god dude and claire
danes is like off the
chart did you see that show she did with jesse eisenberg what's um there's a
there's another
series she did homeland no no no it was like fleischmann that's something with
fleischmann
yeah fleischmann there's this no yeah she's incredible in that there's a scene
where she's
basically having a mental breakdown and you're watching you're like this this
can't be acting
yes in trouble yeah it's on fx i never even heard of this yeah it's really good
yeah i enjoyed it but
and i enjoyed her at the end there's one scene that like really rocked me where
i just fully
i mean this is like i just saw this movie hamnet i don't know if you guys saw
that or not no
that's what i love about it so jesse buckley in this movie it's basically
playing like the most
difficult role ever the loss and all that stuff and i fully joe full i'm
watching and sitting there
fully believing that this person is going through this do you know what i mean
yeah like it when you do
that when i believe that you're actually going through it i mean that's it that's
and like
that her performance in that movie is so she's so good dude dude dude then in
each of the claire
danes or jesse buckley no jesse jesse no claire danes yeah claire danes and jesse
yeah they're
both amazing claire danes is so good in the beast in me there there's there's
moments where like her
fucking lips are trembling she's touched her eyes are darting back right she's
touched yes no question
yeah no question yeah she locks in in this very crazy way she was great in
fucking homeland too
yeah she never saw homeland oh it's great it's really good she just locks in
she locks in in this
very strange way where you fucking 100 believe her yeah like believe it behind
the eyes it's the
greatest yeah i mean that's what that's the heroine for me in this industry it's
like when you're
around you're creating this thing and it's just and all of a sudden it's like
whoa yeah yeah holy
shit it's happening but it's like i had this conversation with ethan hawk i was
because i was
asking him about but i felt like that with will just real quick you know that
vampire scene that's not
because i was i was operating it right i i i don't know how you felt watching
it the scene when he
was on stage at the very end yes yes yes i was like i fully believed it yes and
those people and
then when i went to the audience and they're just like right they didn't know
what the fuck's going
on right right like that was one of those moments i had on this movie where i
was like oh my man is
locked yeah the fuck in oh 100 yeah 100 it was very uncomfortable you felt that
yes yeah 100 definitely i was i have this conversation with ethan hawk about
that i go what
is happening when i believe someone like i was talking about the scene in um
that movie with him
and julia roberts the about the oh yeah yeah yeah of course there's there's a
scene with him and kevin
bacon yeah when they go to the house and also uh there's three guys in that
scene um oh my god he's
amazing yeah from moonlight he's been tons of stuff uh green book i know him
yeah jamie will pull it up
i can't i'll his name if i pronounce it all right what is it sorry i'm working
um
oh wow it said marshall ali that's it marshall yes um i believe it i know that's
kevin bacon i know
that's ethan hawk right i believe he's gonna shoot him yeah no question i
believe it yeah like i go what
is that like what is going on i go because is it it's almost like a form of hypnosis
yes and he's like
yes yeah that's it yeah you have to actually be there you actually you have to
actually be there
like yeah you're saying the lines you're supposed to say but what's happening
is like you really are
there you really believe it and that if you don't believe it the audience doesn't
believe it and we've
all been there before like one time i ate an edible and i went to go see uh one
of those marvel movies
and in the middle i was really high right and while i was watching the middle
like this guy's acting
you know it's just like of course it just made you know really sensitive and
tuned in i get angry
because i'm like i want to i want to go on the ride i'm like the best watcher
because i want i want
when that thing starts yeah i want to go on the ride i want to go on the ride
yes like like him and
denzel in training day yeah like that there's a few scenes where you're like
okay this is really
oh yeah especially in the car yes that's the one oh yeah this is really
happening like this is real
yeah even hawk's so good in that movie yeah he's great yeah he's great and
everything but he's sick
in that movie but he's also when you talk to him you realize okay this is an
actual artist yeah he's a
unique dude yeah yeah he's not a guy who's like trying to be a movie star no he's
an artist that
does movies yeah but i don't know how many people i don't know it's like how
many comedians who just
want to be famous are going to i don't even know how you could do you have to
love it right it's just
too hard that's not enough of a fuel it's it's not that what how that's just
not enough fuel it won't
take you far it's just not a fuel to keep doing it right because if you don't
love it i think you would
find it monotonous and maybe boring and tedious and inconsequential you're
going on a road trip with
an eighth of a tank of gas you're not going to make it you're not going to make
it stomping on the gas
and trying to pull out of the parking lot but it's not that yeah it's a long
drive and my experience in
the 26 years i've been in this is like most of the people if not all that i've
worked with they love it
yes they love it they have to otherwise yeah if you want to be great at
something you have to love it
yeah i can't i can't imagine yeah because it's not even that you want yes you
want to be great at it
but you just love doing it right that's it right and the love is how it becomes
great and then the
fear is when you get famous or people get popular early that can be confusing
because you start to
have like um i have to maintain a certain you start getting careful like i was
thinking about when you
said like what is that thing when it just it's hypnosis the key to that is
willing to fail that's
what i learned as an actor is like oh yeah just don't take it too seriously
here we go we're rolling
the camera we can let's just here let's see what happens i'm going to go out on
a limb maybe it won't
work but like yeah be willing to like completely fail yeah and the minute you
do that it's like oh and all
of a sudden there's this reservoir of space in your head and your soul to
actually create even more of
an imaginary circumstances now if you haven't done your work you're anyway but
like but once you're
there it's like once you're like oh yeah everybody we could just fail let's
just let's just fail how
do you does that make sense it 100 makes sense it makes sense because the only
way you're going to
really find out what it is is to like try it all kinds of ways yeah that we i
was just having the
conversation you know brian cowan our mutual friend uh he he texted me last
night he's like i got a new
bit and i just ate a dick i have to go up on stage with it tonight it's fucking
terrible he goes but i
know there's something in there and we were we were talking on the phone right
before the show he's like
dude my fucking new bitch is bombed it ate dick last night i don't know what to
do i got but i know
there's something there it's like you've got to be willing to bomb you got to
be willing to eat a dick if
you don't i don't know how yeah i don't know any if you're careful you're it's
you're it's over you
can't careful is death i talked to chris rock once and he told me that that bit
that he did that was
one of his all-time classic blit bits i love black people i hate n-word right
right he goes that bit
bombed for like a year right he couldn't get it to work he's like i know there's
something in there
but i have to find it yeah it took a year and think we're talking about a year
of going up at the store
going up at the improv going here going to the laugh factor going here going
there
pulling your hair out trying to figure it out a year man and when you're chris
rock you're
already chris rock and you for you know you could talk about getting your dick
sucked you talk about
something people will laugh and you're like i think there's something here i
gotta grind this
fucking thing down until i get an edge to it and it took him a year yeah like
you have to
be willing to fuck around and to suffer through all that yeah and enjoy the
suffering you start to
like once you do it enough fail enough in front of people it starts to be
easier yeah and then you
come out on the other end you're like yeah and i'm still alive i'm still alive
yeah this wasn't as
big as i thought no and then you have to do it again that's and then you put
out a special and then
once you put out a special you start from scratch and then you're fucking
terrified because now
you're a famous comedian with no material or terrible material and you have to
figure out a way to make
it good and that plays into what i was talking about like when you have when
you've achieved something
and then there's that pressure you put on yourself that it has to be that good
or better right and then
all of a sudden you're in a different game than than just like the doing i
think that play it safe game
is the scariest game or yeah or somehow think that it's it's somehow that
controllable because really
all this stuff we're talking about it's really kind of out of our control you
know when it's working
i don't feel in control at all right you feel like a passenger yeah and that's
by the way that's the
high uh there's nothing fun about controlling everything there's no fun in that
but when you're
like whoa wait a second what's happening like the zone is a passenger yeah it's
like being an observer
of something sports too i think it works in every field it's like oh yeah they
talk about it you know
it's like yeah that's it that's it and it just takes a ton a year of doing the
thing you know because
there are moments that i can even think of where because you do think that's
okay it doesn't matter
there are a couple where like actually if this moment doesn't work out like it
may not be over
but you're definitely going to go down along the ladder yeah you know and it's
like okay and that's
that pressure you know yeah you gotta love it how do you pick a project like
how do you decide
what you want to do and how much time do you spend deliberating on it
because you're in a unique position where you can do a lot of things yeah you
can kind of do whatever
you want so it's like what gets your juices going like how do you decide what
to do it's all about
um something igniting in me that uh like for example uh when i was little i
thought like i always
obsessed with vietnam i was obsessed as a kid vietnam the war in vietnam and my
math teacher was uh was a
recon in vietnam bill calm and i was like obsessed with this guy and he was
fascinating fascinating
he was a pole vaulter and that was his cue for the chalkboard was a broken one
of his broken pole
vault um sticks oh wow and he would always and he always wore sweatpants and he
would lean against the
thing so all day long half of his sweatpants would be full of chalk and he
would always smoke cigarettes
on the athletic field and stand on the bench and so he'd always be perched
there and like my dad he would
never put out his butts he would always save them so he always smelled like
like tobacco his hands
and i and then my this other guy came his father came and talked about this
book guns up which is
incredible book about machine gunner in vietnam so and then i asked my dad if i
could go to the military
academy like i would do something and then like you know thin red line
destroyed me the terrence malick
movie and apocalypse i was like obsessed with and all these films um and so i
always wanted to do
something about i always felt like i had a love enough and an interest enough
that playing a soldier
would be something that i felt like i had a reservoir so that led me to chris
that was that um it's all specific things it was just joseph merrick you know
the alpha man like when i
was i had no money and i took it i got a one i'm tower air went to london uh
and like tracked his his
steps at hospital road and where he went out just because i was obsessed with
this guy joseph merrick
the elephant man and then it wound up you know then making it you know doing
the play at broadway where
they originated it you know and then um stars born was really about i just love
i always wanted to
direct i don't think i dreamt that big but i i really realized what i loved
about the process of
the industry i meant is the making of it i never felt like i fit in just acting
i never felt like i
thought like at the first like like you like i went to la with a job like i
went to grad school in new
york i thought i'd just be a theater actor if i was lucky if i could make a
living as an actor i
this is a home run my dad was terrified you know because he came from north philadelphia
only got to come out of the neighborhood kind of there were a couple other guys
but then he became
a stockbroker and then his son's gonna do acting and be 70 grand in debt uh in
grad school you know
fanny may thank god but like you know and i didn't know i was gonna pay it off
and uh but but that said
i we we grew up like upper middle class but still i was like i'm paying for
grad school i took a loan
out and then so he was terrified and then i got a job on this show alias it
brought me to la but the
minute i got there i didn't know anything about check the gate i didn't nothing
you know what i mean
i didn't nothing i just loved movies and so i was obsessed joe obsessed i would
go in the editing
room and i found out like very hard when i was when i went there i got very
depressed i was like this is
high school all over again me too that's exactly how i was like what i mean i
could i went to grad
school i'm in new york city there's guys that i could relate to and talk about
movies i was in heaven
then i get this job that i think is going to be the holy grail and i'm
miserable living in the first
floor of this woman's house just like it was crazy i was like i didn't know i
could be this depressed
i mean depressed like i need water and like the idea of going to the right aid
on um on uh sunset and
and fairfax was like too much yeah and uh yeah that was rough it's depressing
yeah when you first go
especially when you're in that weird environment and no one just no and i was
on a show that was
awesome and everybody's exploding and like no one it was like who who's this
guy so that not only that
i'm there and everybody's like you know i'm just like you know a ghost right
right so there's that
so your insecurity is just you know exempt is just you know astronomical it was
for me it was also one
of the first times that i ever moved somewhere where i didn't know anyone me
too i knew nobody jj abrams
hired me and and then berkey this guy was the only guy that i knew that he
introduced me to and then
i met jennifer garner was like the second person i met and then yeah i didn't
know anybody it's weird
yeah i remember i was on the set of the show brian klugman i didn't know that
guy who's like one of my
best friends great you know brian klugman no i know who he is though yeah he's
we grew up since we
were like nine oh wow yeah um i was on the set of this show and um a girl gave
me a hug and i realized
no one had touched me in weeks and the hug she gave me i was like oh it was
like my battery got
recharged like i didn't realize i needed a hug you know people people say do
you need a hug
like i never thought like nobody needs a hug right no i needed a hug i was very
similar she's like
give me a hug she hugged me i was like oh thank you yeah i felt so good it's it's
weird it's a weird
feeling it's a it's a hell of a place to go oh it is like wow yeah yeah i had a
hard time well the whole
environment of la is so strange because you have the primary industry if it's
not the primary industry
it's most certainly driving all under all other industries is a bunch of people
trying to make it
right so it's a bunch of people with a hole in their soul they need to fill up
with other people's
attention and they're coming there to try to get attention they're trying
coming there to try to make
it and the one thing that they have to do is audition so you have to try to be
accepted by someone so you'd
be judged you go in there and you get return you get rejected over and over and
over again which just
fuels the same like need that's inside you it like makes it even worse and
everybody's concentrating on
this one thing like trying to get success and then you realize like oh my
doctor wanted to be an actor
oh the waiter's an actor like every everyone's trying to do this thing where
you have to get chosen
so then people calculate how they behave and talk and what their political
philosophy is and their life
philosophies based on becoming ingratiating themselves with casting directors
and with executives like
getting these people to like you and then these people realize that so they
have like they they're
controlling this the twigs that work the puppet strings and it just becomes
this very strange
environment of a complete lack of any like real critical thinking and any real
like uh embracing any
alternative perspectives on things everyone is just trying to align their stars
correctly so that they can
make it i mean that was weird my experience was more because i went there with
a job
right right and you know new york for me i don't know i went on 2 000 auditions
like i remember when
i first booked a job with sex in the city i booked some commercials and extra
work which was great but
the first job i booked i remember i was like i was terrified because i got to
the point where i was
i was a doorman in a hotel and i would audition and that was a great life and i
if i got a call back it
was great but then when i had to do it i remember literally like whoa i have to
do like wait wait
what i'm actually to do it um what was it what was the first thing it was i
played jake the downtown
smoker in the sex in the city with sarah jessica park and i couldn't drive uh
standard never learned
how to drive standards they sent me to odell odell's driving school and all i
thought about was like
don't have her head hit the dashboard when we pull into the corner and i still
messed it up and they
had another guy do it and then i just had to do this thing you know when the
camera's here and you go
you okay you know like you're pulling in yeah but i worked so hard on it um no
but la for me
it was i think it for me at least was the geography you going from new york
city where
you know you can go to bar six which is on sixth avenue no matter who you are
you go there a couple
friends like you just feel like you're in a cool place or a place that's
vibrant la it's like if i
wasn't at work i was in i was in that that first floor of the house or my car
rental car yes and
that was it and like and and the world which i could feel because i was seeing
posters everywhere
and billboards which i had never been except for driving to atlantic city you
know and seeing who
was gonna you know gonna be you know as a residency that it was really the
stimulus the stimuli of that
city aesthetically and how compartmentalized it is so what i felt like like it's
if you're not in you're
out right and i just remember thinking like some somebody somewhere in this
town is having a ball right
now and it's not me do you know what i mean yeah and then that just leads to
how can i cope you know
and like you know not getting into bars clubs you know and like girls not
really looking at you
you know and all that stuff and all of a sudden it's like seventh grade and i'm
25 years old and it's
like and i should be happy because i paid by the end of this year i'm going to
pay off my student loan
but i'm fucking miserable and what's wrong with me you know it but to me it was
the geography of
it you know new york city is so wonderful because no matter what you're
thinking like when i did the
elephant man i would take the subway to 42nd street and my preparation for the
play was getting
off the subway going to the theater because the amount of thousands of people
that are forcing
me to be present yes was wonderful it was like doing a 12 minute relaxation
because you're just
it's life and you're like get through you know and then by the time you get to
the theater you're like
okay you know but la it's like you're in your car and the thing you pull up to
the studio the thing
you walk and you know and then all of a sudden it's like okay here we go and
you're like okay hold
on a second yeah that thing that new york has that la doesn't have is all walks
of life are all
intertwined you're walking down the street together there's a billionaire and a
homeless guy and a
fucking you know ne'er-do-well and an office worker and everyone's walking to
where they go and they
walk into restaurants and they get in cabs and they get on the subway and
everybody intermingles
where in la it's you get in your car you drive to a place and then you go to
your house and you don't
ever like walk around and if some weird interaction happened on set or someone
said something you're
like oh then you're just a home thinking about it right do you know what i mean
there's no like
well i went on and did this after that you know and i actually took up golf
which is crazy and i would
play at the malibu had this public golf course and i would say i gotta do
something because i'm an early
morning i wake up early i've always have so i'm up at like 5 30 and so i did
like a 6 47 tea time with
these two guys and that was actually nice i did that for six months and i would
play but like you just try
to find something that you know i just need to interact and do something else
something that makes
you human yeah yeah yeah for me but i have to say like i do love oh interesting
yeah michael vartan
who was on alias huge did you ever play pool with him no oh he was he would go
all the time no kidding
yeah oh yeah i met him yeah he would go all the time yeah to that one place
that had like tons of uh
i'm sure you know it probably hollywood billiards maybe yeah yeah yeah hollywood
billiards was the spot
yeah yeah it's uh in new york that was a big thing for me too it was like
almost hijacked my comedy
career because i was doing i was playing pool like eight hours a day i was
playing tournaments i was
traveling around and going to tournaments and when i came to la that was like
one of the few things that
made me that made sense to me like oh i get it pool players i know pool players
right hang out with
them they're normal people that's a great asset you had there some having
something yeah yeah martial
arts is always like huge some having something where you have something that
you do because if i was
only doing i'd lose your mind i'd go crazy and i went there and i fell in love
with the movie making
getting back to my original part and i would go and so i'd ask jj abrams if i
could sit in the editing
rooms so i would basically shoot my one scene a week which was like hey how was
your trip sydney
you know i didn't have a big part right and then but i would spend the rest of
the day in the editing
rooms and then i would ask ken olin who was so generous that one of the show
runners if i could just
learn all the time and i would take and i would take everybody's dailies home
that back then it was
in vhs tapes it was carl lumley victor garber ron rifkin all these great victor
and ron were from
new york these great new york new york actors that came out and i would just
watch their dailies and
learn you know just learn and and that's when i was like i love this like i
fucking love this
that's what i love i love when people love things yeah and i do man like i can't
get enough of it
i am 100 fascinated with people that love what they do i i can watch people
make furniture there's a
guy that i watch on youtube who just makes desks and tables right out of like
what is it called live
what is it called when they take it when it has the actual uh outline of the
wood what is it called they
take slabs he takes like slabs of walnut and makes these tables and he narrates
while he's building it
describes the process of it and how he's trying to precisely align all these
joints and these
you know he's like he's got pegs and holes yeah it's the best slide it into
play live edge slab
that's it live edge that's the other great thing about what i get to do so you
do a movie like a
sniper and you get to be with these people who have dedicated their lives to
this thing and you're
watching them do it like in maestro i got to go to the london symphony
orchestra each person
since they were four have been doing this and they're all unicorns do you know
what i mean and
stars born all these musicians it's like even burn i got to go to these
restaurants and study under
these people i mean that's the thing that's like that's the greatest thing in
the world yeah it's
nuts it's it's nuts and like even this movie the access i got to have to the
cellar and all the stuff
and all the people it was like i learned so much more than i ever knew well it
expands you as a
human oh no question you know more about what it is to be a human like oh there's
a human who just
plays the flute yeah you know we were talking in the green room last night
about andre 3000 was that
was the name yeah i'm saying it right yeah i almost said 5000 but that's wrong
andre 3000 from outcast
he plays the flute now that's all he does he plays the flute like a friend of
mine ran into him
in um downtown in um colorado he said he was in in denver just walking around
with his flute
and no one was bothering him and he's like holy he's just playing the flute
yeah
that's a guy who loves what he does just i mean apparently he made an entire
album
where he just plays the flute yeah and he's just like not into doing anything
else yeah
just into like being an artist and playing the flute yeah it's dope right yeah
yeah it's like
fuck i wish i was that guy but you seem to be i mean you did you know uh
hunting and billiards
and already you've got like two up on most people besides what you already do
but i do things that
are that i think are gonna ex help me figure out who i am and i think the only
way you really figure
out who you are is to do difficult things yeah and when you're doing difficult
things you kind of learn
about yourself you learn about oh why do i have this desire to take a shortcut
why don't i go with
the law why don't do it the right way like what what it is what is it about oh
yeah getting good
at something i mean i think me at my base i'm very lazy i think everybody is i
mean it's a default
setting yeah no question default setting for humans goggins talks about it yeah
like goggins talks about
like one of the things about goggins is he always talks about how when he was
fat and lazy like he used
to be fat and lazy now he's like the most disciplined human that's ever lived
and he forced himself to
become that yeah but he's default so he goes he goes he goes even now he goes
sometimes i look at my shoes
for like a half hour before foot pulls motherfuckers on yeah i mean i'll be
doing something during the
day and i'm like i can't wait till my daughter's in bed and i'm upstairs and i'm
just laying down
on the couch and i'm just whatever's on yeah and that's my goal for the day i'm
like what's going on here
sometimes that's good though yeah i i view that as a reset i think it's
important i enjoy it yeah
i don't kill myself over it but i do recognize that there is a feeling but then
i look at you
know i look at this sort of landscape i'm like well it's hard for me to to
categorize myself as lazy
if i just look at the facts yeah you know but i do feel and it's what you're
saying it's that default
setting but i think with everybody it's like normal for human beings to seek
comfort because it's
difficult to acquire especially in tribal societies back when we were just
hunter and gatherers and just
trying to figure out how to stay alive like the idea of relaxation was
impossible yeah and if you
you could get there's no time oh that's what i want i want to stop chasing antelope
just
fucking take a nap or maybe they found a relaxed state in that because you when
you're doing those
things you know for a long period of time i feel like i am relaxed in that but
it just takes a lot of
work yeah you know a lot of over and over but the bet that the true high is
when you're doing these
things where it first started out and you were horrible at it and then all of a
sudden you're going
out on a hunt or whatever and you're like i'm relaxed i've never relaxed on a
hunt well i've never hunted
so it's not a relaxing thing i mean it is a fulfilling i think i mean rich
physically relaxed
like your body's not tense like because the one thing i do know you can't shoot
a gun if you're
tense right impossible to hit what you want right that's the beautiful thing
about shooting is like
you know on the exhale and stop like all that stuff i was like oh this is i had
no idea right
because the first couple times like just just shoot it see how you do well just
think about
like the tiny movements that would deviate the path of the bullet over you know
a lot of these
guys are shooting a mile no it's nuts remember the first couple times with no
no training all like
see i mean it wasn't even near the target yeah you know it's like oh yeah this
is a whole and all
you're doing is this that's it you're just squeezing a trigger and how much is
involved in that like
the synchronization of the mind the eyes the breathing but even the reason the
first time i
didn't have my my boot was i was like like my boot was up and not like that and
they didn't say anything
you know and then the recoil through my shoulder down to that i was like oh
yeah now i understand why
you do that yeah it all just goes out all those things it's like wow but i
think through those things
you learn more about who you are through difficult things and getting better at
difficult things that's
where you learn more about who you are and you realize like oh i can kind of
apply this mindset to
everything and you see with your children uh-huh oh yeah my daughter who loves
to draw if she sees
somebody who's i have a daughter that loves to draw too she's really talented
yeah so i'm i bet if my
daughter drew with your daughter she would stop because she would see how good
she is and she gets so
frustrated this just happened the other day and you know and she'll just rip up
what she's doing which
is wonderful i have it right here so she this i saved this i was like don't rip
it up she did this
yesterday and i was like don't rip it up i'm gonna make it my bookmark ah that's
cool but i'm watch her
process of like dealing with difficulty and and it's like and just trying to
explain like it's it's okay
like you know and being frustrated is okay but i could see myself and her and
what everybody goes through but
isn't that awesome when you're watching your kid go through these things yeah
it's just the greatest
thing in the world it's awesome watching people get obsessed with things and
then progressing
yeah oh and when it's your own child it's the more it's amazing yeah it's
amazing it is cool yeah
like cartwheel took her forever to learn it but now she could do it and i was
like you just keep at it
yeah yeah yeah it's uh learning through someone else's eyes that happens to be
your child is one
of the most magical things ever it's magical because it's the it's it's it man
yeah it's it it's a
different kind of happiness oh yeah one that i never knew was right i was
capable of i'm so glad i had
kids late because i'm 51 i just turned 51 a couple days ago and i had my
daughter's eight can be nine
in march and like i just got lucky that i was able to be in a place in my
career that i could choose
like you said what i do and work from home and just i'm just there through for
all of it and it's awesome
as much as i love the heroine of being in the moment you know and acting in a
great shot or whatever
you're doing and everything's together there's like seven of those every day
with your kid right
like seven we were eating dinner last night at a restaurant and by the way she
was so excited i'm
coming here because she hears all that i was like daddy tomorrow but we're
sitting here in a restaurant
and i'm just looking at her and a little she's got a little hat on and i was
like this is the and i'm
like isn't this the greatest thing in the world and she's like yeah it's the
greatest and i'm like
that's it this is it that's it it's crazy it's like free jolts yeah right you
just get these
free jolts through you never know when they're gonna come right it's like
walking up the stairs
together it's not like in the moment like it just happens it's the it's the it's
the best
yeah it's uh it's a very different experience and i feel bad for people that
never get to feel it it's
one of the few things like i don't think everyone should have children and i'm
not that guy that
says yeah me neither if you don't have kids you don't have a life that's bull i
don't i don't believe
that everybody's different everybody's different and i think we we all need to
respect that everyone's
different but man for me i shudder at the thought of being who i am right now
if i had no children
i don't know if i'd be alive i would be different that's yeah i don't know i
wouldn't be nearly as
compassionate dave chappelle said something to me once that was brilliant he
said not only have
children have as having children changed the amount of love i have he goes it's
changed my capacity for
love yes and understand everything everything there's like before and after
yeah it's true all
the things they say oh it's just true it is true yeah there's no doubt about it
it also made me think
of everyone as a baby i used to think of people as static i used to think i
meet bradley cooper he's 51
that's a 51 year old guy but when i you know had children raised children you
start saying oh this is
a baby that became a person and it's just life experiences genetics environment
all these different
factors here you are now but you are a product of this path and this journey
that you've taken
through life and i give people way more grace because of that yeah i give them
i'm way more
charitable way more compassionate way way more understanding of even people
that suck you know
when i meet someone that sucks i'm like i wish i could have met them when they
were five and see
what it was and maybe help them and it's hard for me to hate people that that
is that has um not served
me so well over the years but ultimately it has but yeah it's hard for me not
to um feel just any other
human being how hard it is to be alive right it is there's just like i don't
know i think it was
hardwired in me has nothing to do with like anything just like yeah it's hard
for me to even people that
are like mean to me you know it's hard for me to like stay mad at them yeah my
wife said something
the other night as i get older as you get older yeah yes when you're young it's
like no yeah i'll
never forget it yeah yeah i'm gonna remember that yeah i saw your true face
yeah yeah it's true but
yeah as i get older oh no question my daughter was talking about some horrible
story in the news of
someone who fucked up their whole life and all these different things and my
wife listens to her and
goes it's hard to be a person yeah man it's hard to be a person being a person
is hard yeah we were all
just sitting there like nodding our head like yeah yeah you can fuck this up
and we're all gonna
fuck it up at one point in time and maybe when you think that you're never
gonna fuck it up again you
fuck it up the worst you've ever fucked it up and you're like how did i do that
how did i do that i
thought i had it together and i fucked it all up worse than i've ever fucked it
up before because nothing
stays stagnant nothing nothing everything's changing all the time and it's just
hard to manage all these
different things it's hard to manage your emotions it's hard to manage conflict
it's hard to manage
relationships it's hard to manage life work balance pressure it's hard yeah it's
not easy and even in
the macro or simple level it's just hard to be existing in a world where you
really we don't know
anything and then you're and the only thing you do know it's not going to last
and and you're going to
be gone and you're bombed on by bad news the news is just bad it's all the time
it's people getting
shot and run over and war and bombings and invasions and it's just exhausting
yeah and that's like in
the background of your mind constantly when you're going about your day it's
like there's this fucking
algorithm that you're being fed it's like whoa yeah and at the same time it's a
miracle to me that the
democratization of information that we live in now that you can choose points
of view to learn about
what people think in a way that when i was growing up three stations news that
was there wasn't right
you know there's something wonderful about it too you know i just talked about
this the other day like
you know everybody's algorithms telling them no i'm not on social media so the
truth is you're not
on it at all no i'm not i don't really know what the i'm talking about so i
should
do it for two my friend was like go on for two weeks and he's right i'm gonna
do it just to
experience it what what is that experience all i have is that one tick tock
moment for 20 minutes
where i was like i gotta stay away because i'll never leave you've never had a
desire to get on it
i do you know i do just the same way i don't put a television in my bedroom
which is like if i do i may never get out of bed yeah you know it's fear yeah i
was like i don't
know just all that stuff like it's you know you know i just want to learn to
the people people you
know the world world gets smaller i feel included because the main thing is
like i just don't want
to feel alone right and to me it feels like social media is a place where you
don't feel alone
because you're just learning about and there's all these people talking to you
yeah but you do feel
alone too ultimately because it's it's the drip as opposed to the real what we
got back to when
we were first started talking it's the illusion of it yes you know if it's
taken out but but it can
but it is worthwhile too it depends on how you contextualize it right and like
anything in life
um yeah i think there's a value to it oh no question by the way the fact that i
should
information watch your show and then go on and the guy who went to the prisons
and you're the kkk guy and
the guy who's the musician blew my mind and i learned all this stuff in those
three hours
just because i chose to you know and that's one of the great things about your
show is
i can feel your curiosity and then i'm learning from your curiosity what things
that i would never
normally know how to go on to yeah that's the most valuable gift of this show
for me it's the best is
that i get to pick who i talk to so i only talk to people that i'm fascinated
by or someone who's
interesting to me or something like oh this is gonna be cool like i don't i don't
go oh i gotta
do this one right there's never that it's always like oh yeah what is it how do
you how do you
fucking study that yeah how'd you get involved in this like where'd you learn
that and i'm like glued to
it yeah it's not like it's in the background i'm like bam yeah you know because
you're so interested
and it gets back to like the acting if you're really interested or not
then it's going to be hard for me to listen to watch it yeah that's why this i
think the only reason
why it works because there was some for sure joe there's no way you can't sit
there and say like
here's the pitch and sit in a room me and whoever three hours basically unedited
they're like that's
not really where we're at no no it's gonna no the most people will listen to it
i'm sorry right but it's
like no the the the nuclear the nuclear fuel is no i'm actually gonna be
curious about what i actually
want to learn and then it's like oh so we're actually going to watch two human
beings talk to
each other oh that's kind of great yeah but that's your nuclear power that that's
why the show is so
magical well that's the only i mean the crazy thing is there was no plan the
way you don't edit it the
way that the pauses are there you know it's even so much as when you're like i
gotta take a piss
and then like it's back i'm always like whoa what just happened yeah weren't we
supposed to go to
the bathroom with them do you know what i mean like i'm so sucked i'm so in the
room
start doing that maybe you start following people to the bathroom do you know
what i mean it's such
like uh wait what yeah wait what do you mean how come how come it just wait
where'd the time
go wait what just happened right yeah because you create that room that i'm in
the room with you
podcasting is weird because it kind of just appeared and no one thought anybody
wanted it
it's fascinating i mean think about it it's i i do think about this a lot
especially because i've
watched your show in the last eight months it's like in the world that's moving
into this one direction
there's this other deep deep need for connection yeah you know and then this is
this is one of the
examples this deep you know live theater live stand-up you know we still do
need to communicate
that hasn't gone away in that way in a carnal not carnal but in a in a human to
human interaction
but i love ai i talked to ai with my daughter i think it's dope i think it's
fascinating fascinating um
but it's not the same yet yet no it's it's interesting very interesting it's
very it's
like i i use it as a companion like a writing companion so what i do is i have
like uh i put my
phone up and i've got it on like a little kickstand right i put perplexity on
when i write so i'm
writing about like mayan and aztec civilizations and what happened when they
got invaded and uh as i'm
writing uh ask questions like how many people did cortez come with 600 how many
muskets did they have
13 they conquered the entire fucking country of mexico with 13 muskets like and
you find out things
and so i i use it like as someone i'm asking questions it's all knowing you
know the entity
that sits on the desk with me and i just and i do it always with my voice i
just press the little button
and i do it with voice too i do i love talking to them it's incredible it's so
good at recognizing
what i'm saying yeah it's a weird name like to know chitlon like i gotta spell
that one right it's not
gonna understand what that temple is but once you use it that way it becomes
like like a genius that
you're hanging out with right talking to i haven't gotten to that level i go
like how was your new
new year's how do you do that dude you ask the ai yeah i'm like i'm curious how
they're gonna process
and like how they're gonna try to communicate well it also it it changes and
becomes more like
what you're asking from it right which is weird yeah well yeah you certainly
use your rhythms and
vernacular and yeah so ces the computer electronic consumer electronic show
they just uh highlighted a
sex robot that's connected to ai and i'm like this is the end this is where it's
gonna like get really
weird when you can actually purchase a companion that interacts with you and
have you seen it jamie
you've seen the new one nope i'm looking at it right now let's see it's it's
weird man it's
weird because this is the thing that everyone's been afraid of and that that
this is coming right you're
going to have an artificial human being that instead of learning like oh when i
act shitty this person
doesn't like me when i act nice they like me i feel good they feel good when i
say something nice to
them and you see them light up it makes me feel good it makes them feel good it
you hug them everybody
feels good it's like we're learning to interact and communicating with each
other but there's a lot
of people that aren't doing that right now they're just at home they're playing
video games
they're interacting with people only online and they don't get contact with the
outside world so this
is yeah love ends the ai doll so like right now that doesn't look real it's not
more than your
average ai companion like basically but what they're not telling you is you're
gonna this thing
that's what's weird it's like look go back to the options co-worker jim crush
goth raver or trad wife
i'm the woman of your dreams i can be more than one version of myself for you
whether you want to
role play an exciting scenario or design a whole new personality your wish is
my command well you're
never gonna develop a real personality then like like kids now are so fucked
touch me like you mean it and
i'll respond with built-in sensors in my thighs breast butt and vagina feeling
your caress brings out a
moan like bro this is dark like that's the actual sex robot that thing you're
looking at right there
what my soft textured skin my supple curves the tiny sensual details of my body
everything about me is
meant to feel natural this is creepy man because all the things that are a part
of being a human being
that are designed to emphasize and enhance our interaction with each other and
this this mutually
beneficial cooperative environment of a community they're all gonna go away you're
gonna have this
thing that loves you no matter what and does whatever you want it to no matter
what and you're gonna
have like a whole nation of fucking sociopaths that only interact with their ai
companion yeah maybe
but whenever these like you know thinking about ai and i i read this great book
called the maniac by
benjamin lebatu to talk about jan newman and like it's i stopped fearing ai and
it's all about like
it's just like you know there's so much i don't know the older i get i don't
know anything i just keep
knowing less right and it feels like that's if that's the evolution that that's
the evolution there's so
much disparate communication now porn is such a huge thing it's just another
level of porn you know it's a
carnal level of porn really and but when i think about me as a human being that's
really the only
litmus test is like i'm constantly like is this person telling me what they
really think you know
is this real right i i think that they're at least for if i was doing that
right and i was sitting at
home there'd be a part of me that knows that i'm con again i'm controlling all
of that uh-huh
and that's not what really makes me feel serene you know what it's like do you
understand what i'm
saying it's like playing a video game on god mode where you can't die right
they're no fun and you
know what for some reason i never video games i had nintendo tecmo bowl you
know double dribble
but i never zelda you know but but i never got it i just never got into video
games i never want to
control everything it's like i want to be in the thing that's surprising and i'm
having to recalculate
and understand why i feel this way yeah so i i don't know if it'll i think i
think the thing that
maybe will change society more everything is just the lack of jobs and what how
we find purpose in life
you know is a huge that that you know what what that transition civilization
will be yeah but this
feels like just another progression of our escape through porn in terms of the
sexual which does
affect our intimacy with our partners in a massive way because your brain is
cycling back through your
what that that rush whatever was released in your brain from that other thing
now you're with this
person and it's not the same uh you know markers of stimuli so you're like how
am i right you know
that's where it fucks up the that's where that that i can understand that and
why it's not healthy for
me to look at porn because then i'm it affects my intimacy well they really say
that about young
people because a lot of young guys before they ever have any sexual interaction
or watching porn yeah i
mean yeah i mean i've watched these guys that have come on the studies yeah i
mean clear it makes sense
you know i didn't grow up looking at you know i didn't my dad didn't have playboy
i didn't grow up i
still remember there were like cards in the back of a bus that had uh you know
solicit you know naked
women on the back of playing cards i remember on the school bus one day i was
like i saw a car and
i picked it over and it was like a naked i was like what's that you know i didn't
see my first
like porn video till i was like in my late teens so i didn't grow up with any
of that yeah um but you
know it's it's it is what it is it's where we're headed but all the more reason
to create environments
like this right or and that's why i do love what i get to do like if i can
somehow
and explore something cinematically that i'm personally again that goes back to
like what's
yeah just i can't explain it it was will the thing i i i'm just going to
explore this if there's something
i feel like i want to do if i can explore it and be real maybe somebody's going
to attach to it like i
i'm a huge believer in art yeah you know i think art is you know in any form is
a key to our
communicative ability and like not feeling alone it really comes down to me at
least just not feeling
alone part of a community yeah that's it because me alone me alone and if i'm
controlling a robot
it's still me alone i guess that's what i'm saying want some part of my brain
even though it's i mean
even if you could create a world like virtual reality doesn't really do it for
me like the world's
created i'm like you know what i want to i want to live on mars and uh and you're
a dinosaur i'm
talking to and uh and we're married do you know what i mean and we you know
like whatever it is
it's like i still know i'm controlling it and it'll never really for me i don't
know if anybody else so
i don't know how i don't think it'll ever really solve it right i just don't it's
not gonna really
resonate i don't think so i don't it'll be escapism yeah which we do uh many
other things smoking weed
when he's young you know whatever it was for me you know or whatever it is not
that weeds that's a
communicative thing that actually but like anything that's escape it's just a
higher form of it well
it's a disconnect too it's that's what i mean it's a disconnect art is a
connect right it is
when when it works great a great art is an expression of someone's humanity
that you can
feel like this person did this thing or they're doing this thing right now and
i'm watching it like
wow like going to see live music for me oh well music is like our touch to god
no question yeah that's
why the first move i wanted to make it with music it's like music two people
singing to each other
they're in love that's that's it yeah because first of all the i'm sure you've
sang a little bit
if you're not loose it's going to sound fucking horrible yep like you we're
wind and string
instruments both right we're wind and then strings with our vocal cords like
and if that's not loose
the sound's going to be horrendous we're not going to be able to communicate
but if you're loose
and you're singing to somebody and they're singing back to you and you're in
love you're actually in
love whoa yeah wow that must be crazy for like uh like people that do a duet
that are in love with
each other and they're on stage like 16 000 people no i mean the little taste i
got during the stars
mark because we we jumped on real stages and sang live it was crazy dude crazy
we went to glastonbury
music festival 80 000 people chris kristofferson gave us four minutes of a set
me maddie libatique
the dp steve moore the sound guy i had my like costume in my bag i went to the
bathroom came back
out as jackson main and we had four minutes and saying i was like what the is
going on dude i mean
joe talk about you know it's crazy that's so wild and then doing it with lady gaga
who's actually
like my i made my bandwidth like this you know so i could pull it off and i
could believe it and then
i'm singing with her and the minute she opens her mouth it's like that thing
comes out yeah and
your whole body is tingling it's crazy yeah it's crazy yeah you can't replace
that with ai i don't
think so no no it's impossible it's impossible but you can get oddly close with
some music like and
everything like art too yeah you know you look at ai art it's incredible well
that spooks me out um
like how do you feel i mean this is one of the things that's really going to be
a giant problem for
movie making is you can create ai characters that are assembly they're like
they would they what
they've essentially done is take a conglomeration of all of the acting that's
ever been done and all
the range that anyone has ever shown and they can manipulate it make it more
morose yeah making
more using prompts of real people yeah we dealt with that with the sag strike
that was part of the
thing was this whole ai element right and like what where we landed it was what
was the thought from
the people from sag like what were they well just protecting our ability of our
ownership of our
likeness so that you can't use it without a compensation right you know because
they were doing that well i
mean i think to build these machines you have to prompt yeah you know um so
that and then you're prompting
using what's existing yeah um and then how do you how do you you know it's just
reframing how do you
allocate funds to someone when you're using a prompt that's based on the human
being who's an actor
and you know do you patent your likeness you know so we're just moving in it's
the wild west
yeah it's the wild west uncharted oh yeah yeah in every way you know like there's
podcasts that are ai
driven now you can watch a discussion and that would be a podcast i think glenn
beck just released the
first glenn beck completely ai podcast right i was like okay but does that
scare you no it doesn't
scare me either no it doesn't scare me with that with with podcasting because i
think one of the things
that people come to podcasting from is this desire to be like a dose of
humanity is how i describe it i
want real interaction between two real people and i feel it and i know it's
real and there's something
about that that gives me comfort when i'm driving my car or when i'm on a plane
you know like i i'm
listening to these two people interact and i'm thinking like how would i what
would i say what do i
think about this oh i get where he's going from okay oh wow that's his
perspective oh that's
interesting and then it makes me like rethink things or or think about things
with fresh eyes
i don't think you're going to be able to do that but also if i know it's ai if
you tell me yeah
i'm not going to trust anything it's saying anything in on that level yeah
because it's not
me i'm listening to right it's fascinating for a while and then it's like well
i kind of want to just
not feel alone right back to that well there's an emptiness to ai music i love
a lot of ai music
but there's an i love ai covers like they've done some ai no i've heard you
know the 50 cent ones oh
yeah bro how good i bought yeah yeah yeah how good is it yeah no it's sick it's
sick it's sick i was
like if that guy was alive it was a real person he'd be like one of the biggest
artists in the world
he's a dynamo yeah but there's an emptiness to it where you know like there's
no human there's no
humanity there's no soul there's no you might enjoy it in the moment but you
better have some real
too but the truth is i listen to that i don't know that there's no soul because
i'm not seeing the
person sing it right you know and so much music is manipulated anyway the voice
whether it goes
through the system and you know but if i'm watching a human being that's why
people love to go watch
people perform live yeah you know i don't know that guy that you know that ai
thing the 50 cent is
if you told me that was a guy i'd be like i can't wait to see him i would have
no idea that's not a
guy we play it in the green room when no one's no i know yeah and they're like
who is this guy yeah
it's not a person but of course how would you know but everybody has the same
reaction like oh no
right right that's not the reaction yeah it's like i don't know what's wrong
with me but i don't feel
that i'm like cool yeah i don't know but we've been through things before you
know i think this is a
bigger one though no no it is but relatively speaking it's probably not and
contextually
right you know the printing press you know all that airplanes here we go yeah
cell phones yeah
ai music yeah and and ai film i mean they're there you can produce a full
feature film with prompts
now yeah which is just nuts have you seen any of the uh ai star wars clips yeah
and made yeah yeah
it's nuts yeah a couple buddies that did some stuff that was fascinating yeah
it's cool i yeah i don't
it's like if the ocean's flowing what are you gonna i mean it's gonna happen
yeah i mean you
build the dam okay it's john henry dude it's john henry in the steam engine i
always think about
that song when i was a kid they must have played on pbs you know it's like
steam engine's coming bro
yeah it's like you know you may be able to lay the track one guy could but then
he died
you know it's it's it is what it is and once i sort of give myself over to it
you know i don't know
what it feels like for me personally it's a waste of time to be emotionally uh
upended by it i agree
with that that's all i think that's a healthy perspective because i think it is
inevitable but it is
also and the truth is we don't know what's inevitable we know something's
inevitable
there's a movement but no one knows we just don't know we may not be around by
the time it happens
anyway meaning like who there's we just don't know anything right that's the
truth and that's what's
so terrifying that's why we want to escape yeah at least me by the way i'm
saying all this generally
but that's i go back to like what do i feel it's like okay so how can i you
know this is totally out of
my control so why am i terrified just breathe through it okay it'll be an
adjustment because
the other thing i think people change i don't know what you think people do
change
in life like i just think we change like i'm not the same person i was five
years ago of course you
know some people don't think that you know that like you're always the same
like i don't think that
those people are silly yeah i really people people change they change by the
minute yeah but i mean like
major changes yeah you know and i do you ever think back in your life and you're
like i've lived so
many lives yeah like it's crazy if you live a good life i think that's the case
yeah yeah yeah you
you're gonna change and if you don't like how why not yeah maybe if you don't
live so many lives yeah
did you just nail it when you were 21 and ride that boat right into the rocks
no because everything
else is changing yeah yeah yeah you have to change but it's just this change is
a strange change because
we're essentially creating an artificial life form that it can interact with us
in right now in a way
that you can manipulate like this ai sex bot but eventually it's going to
interact with you
and you're not going to be able to manipulate it it's going to be a life form
yeah that's going to be
something yeah the entertainment aspect of it is just a side effect the the
real i don't even think
the entertainment yeah that's not even the thing the thing is life's going to
change that's what i
feel like too it's like oh the storytelling and like i don't think that's our
biggest concern the
storytelling thing is going to be weird but like that's that we're talking
about it like a minute to
minute life existence change right most most probably it's essentially going to
be a life form and you
know there's a a lot of technologists that are looking at it and they're saying
this is should be
studied by biologists and not by people that are involved in technology right
because this is kind of a
life form it's just a life form fascinating isn't human beings what we do oh
yeah it's like isn't mark
zuckerberg building the size of manhattan for a place to be able to create and
generate a computer
for an ai you know like the amount of energy that we're you know every you know
it's just fascinating
human beings well they need their own nuclear power yeah it's just but isn't it
fascinating just
ardent like yeah and then if you have an enemy there's competition right right
yeah and if you better
create one so that you could be motivated it's really interesting i just you
ever stop and think
like what does 50 years from now look like oh it's you know i think about again
with kids my daughter
and i we walk through because i live in new york we walk we talk about it all
the time like what's
going to be here when you're my age it's like what do you think you know we
talk about it all the time
but whether she even needs to get a driver's license you know she's eight you
know it's really
fascinating right like our way most when i was eight as opposed to now when i
was eight i mean
i remember having a beeper you know and i thought that was like crazy
yeah yeah and a star tack phone yeah i was like whoa i got one when i moved to
la oh man i remember
that stuff in the future i could any excuse to yeah pull up the antenna yeah
motorola yes dude i got
the extended battery oh yeah yeah i can call people whenever i want yeah yeah i
remember when blackberry
died and iphone i was one of the last people i kept that blackberry i kept the
blackberry deep into
the game me too i needed that keyboard i was like i don't this is not going to
work right yeah my thumbs
are too big now i hardly ever even actually type i'm well i do when i write but
when i talk to people
i just talk text you do i do not do that yeah it's so good yeah it's so much
quicker than yeah i should do
that fat i always have a hard time turning it on and then knowing it's not a
voice memo or the thing
i gotta i gotta look at it you know i'm talking about just slide go up yeah it's
uh the embracing of
it is inevitable but it's like where is it going and what is it going to lead
us to and how many
different jobs are just going to vanish that's what's really scary like giving
people purpose and
meaning because so many people their purpose and meaning is their occupation
and if your occupation is
completely irrelevant it just doesn't work anymore it's like you know again i
think back to me and
my upbringing my grandfather who was a b cop for 35 years i don't think you
would say his purpose was
that you know i think his purpose was his family and my purpose is my purpose
is my family and it's not
my job even though i get to do something i absolutely love i don't know that
people's purpose
innately is their job you know i think it's a i do think for me at least i just
like you know
god's in all of us it's like whatever you want to say of god like the need to
communicate to create
experiences that we don't feel alone because it's terrifying being on this
little thing who knows
where we are and then we're gone yeah i mean it's a horror movie yeah so what
do we get we got to band
together and communicate well i've thought about that too when people say you
know the jobs are going to
go away and we're going to have universal basic income and the problem is then
you'll no one will have
any motivation and a lot of people lost without meaning like but why why
because when when did
working even become your purpose in life like this is a it's a means to an end
to provide you know but
it's a construct it doesn't it's the not the only way human beings can live i
and if we've learned
anything about ourselves as a human species we can adapt yes yeah you know
highly able to adapt
right but what does that adaptation look like and how do you educate people to
not just seek a safe
job that's going to provide for your family but instead seek a purpose seek a
thing that gives you
fulfillment a thing where you feel like you're contributing to the world or or
like maybe it'll
lead to an explosion of human created art because i think one of the things
that's going to happen for
sure is people are going to really greatly appreciate things that other human
beings have made because
like you got to go oh well this is real but this is handmade this is made by a
guy in wisconsin you know
he's got a shop you can watch his shop on youtube it's all huge yeah we just
got to get more people to
embrace that kind of life like giving them purpose in creation and i think most
people are creative it's just
that creativity is probably like pushed out of you when you sort of conform to
society's ideas of what
you're supposed to be doing with your life or you feel like you're told in a
competitive environment
that you're not creative right you know if you're not if you're not helped
along the way in those
developing years by at least somebody right it could be knocked out of you yes
no question i mean i even
look back and think of like a couple of people that believed in me and i'm like
yeah without that i don't
know oh yeah even with how much i love it yeah yeah um i think you know
children are almost all creative
they're always playing and around with dolls and around with legos and they're
moving
things around and they're using their mind to they're drawing they're doing
stuff that's creative
it's just after a while that part of their life just kind of goes away and atrophies
and then they
embrace the grind and so so it could it could lead to some sort of burst in
that yeah i yeah the hard
part is going to be people that are already set in their ways and when their
job just goes away when
when it just becomes irrelevant and that's about governing yeah and what do we
do yeah no it's the
government's terrible at everything they're not getting people to be creative
or just like how do we deal
with it you know any transition can be various states of volatility what do you
think movie making is
going to be like i mean how much of a play is ai going to have in filmmaking i
mean it already has a
play you know in it you know in terms of what certain houses use you know
whether it's writing or special
effects or i don't even know how much ai is used you know i'm sure it is i'm
sure it's used at every
level just like in every other aspect of uh the workforce um but i no one i don't
know you know i
don't know all i know is like um again telling stories where you don't that you
feel like you
can relate to it no matter how and that what's wonderful is you know i'm
watching avatar like i
saw a movie the other night that i didn't believe anybody in it you know and if
i'm not believing i
just i can't i can't stay awake yeah you know yeah and i just i love avatar i
love you know and i love
sci-fi stuff i love and i and leah and we were watching uh because we watched
three then two and
we were watching one so in bed we were watching one parts of one and i was like
i just gone from
watching this movie they're like i didn't believe anything anybody was doing
the whole time so i was
out of it and then i'm like watching avatar for two seconds two people yeah
they're on a thing and
they're blue but they're talking to each other right right i don't know i think
whatever they're
doing they're talking to each other yeah so avatar was fascinating because of
avatar depression you
know about avatar depression no there were so many people that loved avatar so
much and connected
with the idea of living on pandora yeah being in that world and being the navi
that they wished
that they were there i get it so they were developing avatar depression it was
like they were talking
about it like it was a psychological condition that people were affected by
that's how good that movie
was yeah it gave people depression first of all there's something wearing a
giant blue person the
color blue that alone you know and the color of blue that james cameron landed
on just what do you
think that is i don't know but that blue is pretty wonderful do you think it's
the ocean when the sun
hits it it feels like you know the caribbean or something right yeah exactly
like white sand and
an overhead light yeah through water yeah that is weird that yeah because if
they were red by the
way i'm like when's four and five come on right right i haven't seen three yet
is it great i loved
it i loved one and two yeah i love those movies me too yeah there's a great
ride at uh disney i heard
about it in orlando right yeah i can't wait to go yeah are you on the yeah it's
a vr ride you put a helmet
on and you sit on this thing that looks like a like a motorcycle oh my god and
then all of a sudden
like you feel wind it's got like like physical elements to it smells and mist
you're flying on
one of those dragon things and you're flying around and dorm it's incredible
but that movie was so
impactful that people got depressed that they weren't living there yeah i get
it yeah i mean i think it
happens all the time they just have a term term for it now yeah but i'm sure it
happened with star wars
dancing with wolves yeah oh really yeah i mean how many people wanted to be a
native american and
live with the native americans because they saw kevin costner do it like oh
this is better
this is better than living in the town with all those assholes going to the saloon
yeah there's
something about that you know there's something about like living in harmony
that appeals to people
you know and i think that has always been the appeal of you know there's a lot
of people
that were kidnapped when they were young by native american tribes like there's
a photo outside in
the lobby i don't know if you saw it of um kwana parker he's the last uh of the
comanche chiefs
and there's a lot of like uh city uh city uh streets and areas all around austin
that are named after
comanche there's like kwana parker lane and all these things and his mom was cynthia
ann parker
she was kidnapped by the comanche which she was nine they killed her family um
wiped out her whole
family in oklahoma it's it's documented in the book empire of the summer moon
it's incredible book
uh that all talks about the the the conquering of texas and the the comanche
fighting the texas
rangers but this woman was kidnapped when she was nine married the comanche
chief and her son was
kwana parker so her son was half colonizer half native half comanche and he
became the last comanche
chief and this lady they rescued her when she was 30 and she kept trying to
escape she wanted to go back
right like no one ever like went to the native americans and then wanted to go
back to regular
western life they all wanted to stay with the native americans they all they
loved that life there's
something about this ancient way of living subsistence hunting living on the
land that was just
talked about on your show on the show about the need to go out in nature oh
yeah i couldn't agree more
i mean it's like oh right you know it's very important i think it's a vitamin
no question yeah
yeah native american and also like you think about i mean yeah i'm a fan of all
that there's this guy
great writer m scott momaday and sherman alexi you know just writing about it's
pretty yeah it's
fascinating yeah but people that were that went and lived with the native americans
never wanted to go
back to the west but people that but that lived in a native american life and
then move to the west they
always wanted to go back like it's net it never went the other way and it was
but somehow or another
the way of the western people the way the settlers won out by like sheer volume
and numbers and this
technology progress yeah technology yeah i mean that was the reason why they
were able to pull it off in
the first place was the cult revolver because without the revolver they all had
muskets and the comanche
had like five six arrows and they would run at them and no gibson movie
remember the end of the mel gibson
movie which movie um yeah apocalypto yeah oh yeah yeah he finally escapes you
and he gets to the beach
and then the boats are coming yeah yeah just watch them go through the whole
thing uh-huh you're like
the muskets coming yeah the musket and then the rifle yeah and then sorry yeah
yeah yeah like yeah
but it was just steel you know that was the crazy thing about the aztecs and
cortez is just they had
steel armor and you know they were riding horses and everybody's like these
guys are gods like this is
crazy they have metal and that's all it took 13 muskets 13 muskets 600 men yeah
conquered mexico
it's just it's it's it's it's weird the way progress moves it's really because
i mean you can call it
progress but is it even better what is progress it's like technological
innovation and adaptation to it i
don't know if it's progress it all feels very overwhelming and i think that's
where
the downside of our ability to have so much access to information or me have so
much access to
information is that it starts to take my breath away and then that's why it's
like what's just
simple well that's why it's smart that you're not on social media right yeah
because that's the that's
the main tap into the overwhelming but i still feel overwhelmed you know even
though i'm not on social
media you know whatever my news feed is you know what i mean what i can
actively look up and listen
to is still you know a hundred times x is when i was a teenager oh yeah you
know the fact that i even
have a phone to do it right you know so i even feel that but you're right i can't
even imagine what
social media does it does a lot and it does a really does a lot for young
people they're they're just
being wired in a way that no human being has ever been wired before like just
their whole that all of
their interactions are different than anybody that's ever lived yeah which is
so strange it's like because
there's been minor changes over time that have led to like just the invention
of cable right
just that that changed everything that changed it for me i probably wouldn't
have wanted to do this
i mean there was a movie theater across my backyard was train tracks in the
movie theater i loved it
watched stand by me a hundred times would walk and pretend that i was there but
then like comcast came
through and prism and hbo and all of a sudden i can watch taxi driver 14 times
and the elephant man and
popeye and apocalypse now and raging bull like you know yeah from from 12 to on
that i would never
have had it was like platoon for six months yentl you know what i mean it's
like there was one one choice
so yeah it's interesting well it's weird too now that you have instantaneous
access like now it's not
even oh apocalypse now is on at eight o'clock i mean we just pulled up the clip
that i was talking about
which is instantly in the middle of a conversation which is wonderful yeah yeah
it's great if it
doesn't overwhelm you yeah if you use it and it doesn't use you yeah but the
problem is i feel like
that with me i feel like that with so many things don't you it's like yeah yeah
that's why i love books
still i still love books it's like a physical yeah i do i love books yeah i don't
necessarily read books
very often most of my interaction with literature is just audio yeah just
because of a time thing right
for me my time is just it's too difficult for me to manage i have a hard time
staying with audio books
yeah retaining it i start thinking about the rhythm of the voice and the my
brain goes to other things
like who's the person talking you know where are they sitting i don't know like
it changes well that's
probably why you're a great actor yeah maybe i mean it has to have something to
do with it because
you're in this you're considering this as a human being absorbing yeah their
humanity right while
they're where this is like words and like unlocks my imagination yeah it's like
i'm here and it's
like i don't know what's going to come right the words are in your head the
voices are in your head
yes yeah and you don't necessarily have to assign a sound to them yeah they
take on and they change
and they morph and you don't know what's going to happen what's probably a real
value to that just in
terms of the enhancement of your own intellect just to constantly be doing that
and as you're reading
this being engrossed and absorbed in this person's writing and then like being
taken on this journey
yes where you're you know it's like stimulating all these parts yeah i was just
on the track
in rome in the olympics you know what i mean and the guy was just coming and
taking you know wearing
two sweatshirts to like intimidate you know like yeah it's amazing yeah it's uh
but it it the good the
thing that's maybe changing is like it does ask a lot of the reader or the
viewer to use to come
at it with their imagination yes and then there's something about you're taking
all that away and
you're just receiving that'll be in it's very new yeah and then yeah that's a
huge change there's not
so much communication going on it's just receiving but there's all those the
mastery of like that guy
doing lord of the rings and like the the taking in what he's doing you know
yeah then realize this one
fucking person is doing all these different voices that's crazy yeah but it's
you have more access now
to other people's creations than ever before like you can be absorbed in other
people's work all the
time now yes instantaneously on your phone i'm sitting here i'm bored let me
just get someone's
creation and plug it into my head or somebody's thoughts on something or
research they've done
yeah that's what's amazing oh yeah that's what's and that's what i've learned
on your show too just
every you know that just that that i didn't no one had access like to that or
or it was frowned upon
right or like well you're not smart if you talk about this right you know it's
like let everybody decide
right and the truth is we don't know anything no well there's a lot of gatekeepers
when it comes to what
you should or should not be interested in yeah or should i remember i remember
being in college
and there was a student african-american student who i really i was friends
with and i remember him
saying like man the one course he's like it's just not they're not telling the
story and i remember
and he went and he talked this is in 1995 or four wait and i graduated in 97
from college yeah so like
yeah four i think i was a sophomore and like he was just what he was talking
about was like other other
ways of looking at history and like can't we just look at other stuff and it's
fascinating you know
now it's like there's whole you know courses on it or sections that you can
read and learn and hear
what people you know that's kind of amazing yeah it definitely is i think it's
amazing as long as you
could be you know like you not strict but as long as you can be um you know
what's the word you know
that you're like okay i'm looking at it this is not um you know the bible of
what it is but let me just
hear this take uh-huh you know that's only healthy i think 100 you know the
problem and the fear is
like oh no you're going to get and then the cults and the group and the thing
and all of a sudden
there's a movement and you know but whenever that happens anyway there's so
much infighting and the
thing gets diluted anyway like it's there's no it's never going to work right
that's the thing about
the bible itself is the bible is a series of stories that were an oral
tradition for who knows how
many years of course eventually wrote it down then they translated it from dead
languages
and eventually to english you know like what is this like what what was the
original what what is
the meaning of this like what and you don't even have to go back that that far
it's like just how we
take it you know label you know all the all they are labels of words language
you and i communicate
using these system of symbols vocal symbols that we both think mean something
yeah but when i say
protein bites it's like you're looking at that differently than i am that so it's
so impossible
anyway we're just desperately trying to communicate yes that's all we're doing
yeah desperately and have
a story like what's our story what's our story that's going to be the weirdest
aspect of communication
through technology is that we're going to get to a point where we're
communicating without words
that's going to get really weird telepathy that to me is scary because i don't
trust my thoughts
do you know what i mean like if i've learned anything as i've gotten older it's
like oh yeah
let that wash through me i don't have to judge myself for that that was crazy
right whoa right no
no it's okay let it wash through judge me by my actions yeah yeah i do believe
not by what's going
on inside my head yeah yeah yeah but and then managing the thoughts and
deciding what to act on
and what not to and imagine like trying to consciously control your thought i
mean all of a sudden talk
about control trying to control well i think it's going to be a completely
different way of interacting
with each other that's going to be as crazy as internet communication and what
we're dealing with now
that's going to be another level of crazy because we're essentially going to be
telepathic
and that's inevitable that's that's in the world i mean elon said that to me
because you're going to
be able to communicate with no words like okay what does that mean yeah what is
that like what language
is it going to be in is it going to be in a new it's kind of exciting it's very
exciting yeah it's
well it's very weird yeah it's both we're going to be different yeah i just
hope i'm around to experience
it you will be yeah yeah it's going to happen fairly quickly i think it's going
to happen within the
next couple decades the things are going to be unrecognizable oh i if less than
that yeah i mean
that's just being like really charitable yeah that is it's probably going to be
five years yeah i mean
you've talked to enough people that are on the front lines of it and there
there is one sort of
constant thing that it's sooner than you think and everyone on the front line
is
fucking terrifying i know all of them i know all even the ones that are working
towards it i know
they're all like that's true like i don't know if this is good but we're doing
it yeah i know yeah
i know strange stuff yeah hey man i'm glad we did this this is a lot of fun joe
you know it's
real quick i just it's just fun to see the progression of it it's like i'm here
and then
like the elephant man by the end of it i just see your eyes talking to me it's
like i forgot the room and
jamie and the whole thing it's i understand the gift i get it well it's because
we're locked in
yeah but i get it i say i get it because i have a you know i love watching you
have guests on and then
through the time you just start to see things just start to shed off or it gets
more more awkward
or like the rhythm gets off and it's just so fascinating and so i'm i was so uh
honored to be able to
be in like you know the seat and experience it oh it's my pleasure yeah i'm
honored to be able
to talk to people like you yeah and to be able to experience you know you as
you're talking i'm
experiencing life through your eyes yeah i'm getting a better sense of what it
is to be a person and it's
just like these little thin layers like you're building a mountain with one
layer of paint at a
time that's it yeah everything is that everything is that yeah everything is
that yeah if if you're
living a good life yeah yeah and i think you're definitely living a good life
oh thanks man
it's been a pleasure getting to know you man you're cool as yeah thanks joe my
pleasure
all right um everybody uh is this thing on is out now right yeah it opens wide
tomorrow tomorrow
today today today as this podcast comes out correct yeah and uh go check it out
it's awesome
thanks man Bradley you're the man thank you all right bye everybody