#1992 - Oliver Stone

Three Mile Island and Chernobyl and Fukushima. We have these ideas in our mind about the dangers of nuclear power. And I love the analogy that you made in the film about how driving a car is not scary, but it's dangerous, flying in a plane feels scary, but it's far safer. And this is a great analogy to nuclear power. When you went over the data, when you talked about the amount of deaths from coal every year, when you talk about the amount of deaths overall ever from nuclear, it's stunning. It is. It's stunning. And then when you cut to, in the documentary, you showed the anti-nuclear movement that happened after Three Mile Island. Yeah. And how crazy it was. All these stars and celebrities, and they're doing concerts, we've gotta stop nuclear power, and what a mess. That happens when a fad becomes fashionable. Yeah. It was a very successful movement. You're talking about the negatives here, and the accidents. We cover all that in the film, which is called Nuclear Now. And the idea that was behind it was because I really was like you. I went along with those things in the 70s and the 80s because I didn't know better. I wasn't educated. I really wanted to know what is nuclear power. I wanted to go back to the source. And you gotta go back to the beginning, and you gotta go back to Marie Curie and Albert Einstein and World War II. It's a beautiful, incredible, almost a miracle that was given to us. We have an Earth. It's all, it's in the Earth. Uranium, it's everywhere. And we, in a sense, we took it like Prometheus and we kind of misinterpreted it, misused it, which is kind of normal given what we do with natural things. World War II was happening just as the, as the mission was being understood, and that made the bomb. They made the bomb with it because there was a war on. The, in Los Alamos, but, and they got it, and they were successful. But as you know, it was misunderstood at that point that nuclear energy was not nuclear bomb. In the contrary, it was, a bomb is very difficult to build, and it takes a lot, it takes years sometimes. It takes scientists, and they have to enrich the plutonium, and they have to work at it. There's all configurations in the bomb that don't exist. So when people see a nuclear energy plant, they subconsciously, they cross it with both war, and they cross it with horror. Spider, the spider bites the man, and he becomes Spider-Man. You know, it's incredible the stuff that happens, and it's all, and Hollywood has done no favors to it. It's continued for years and years and years, and then, of course, you had Three Mile Island. The film was coming out at the same time, China Syndrome, with Jane Fonda, it was a good film. I enjoyed it, we all enjoyed it, but it really was hysterical. Happened at Three Mile Island, except the reactor did melt down, but nobody got hurt because the containment structure worked to keep it in, so there was no release of radiation. And they continued on, Silkwood was another one, and then, if you remember, not too long ago, there was the HBO thing, Chernobyl, which was a complete fictionalization of what happened at Chernobyl. So we went to Russia, and we talked to the scientists there, and we wanted to know what happened at Chernobyl, and we find out that it's in the film. And the same thing is true for Fukushima, which is unbelievable, because when you go to the bottom of it, I was astounded to find out that nobody... They checked the whole thing out, and it's been done to death, but you hear about 15,000, 20,000 people die. So the earthquake... We show the tsunami of the wave was 100 feet tall. There was a badly built wall. The wall was not a seawall that could hold, and the generators were flooded beneath the water. And these were also not state-of-the-art. That's right. It's what they can do now in terms of... Everything gets better. Everything gets better. I mean, but even those nuclear reactors... They're legacy reactors. They do work, and we mustn't dismiss them. Yeah, it gets better. Technology gets better. As in any business, there's another generation, and it's better, hopefully better. But the point is that they can avoid what happened in Fukushima today. Fukushima was... If you look at closely, Japan had built... The same earthquake and the same kind of tsunami. Several of them were on that same coastline. But this particular one, this... And even then, all the radiation that was released, there was a hydrogen explosion. That radiation released in the air, you heard about it. It was supposed to be another turn... They're taking tests on all the Japanese citizens, and it's low-level, what they call low-level radiation, which is we can sustain it. We have DNA in our body. I want to point out very well in the film that there's a lot of radiation that you don't even take into consideration that you encounter constantly. But it's just a thing. You get it from being outside. You get it from rocks. You get it from all sorts of things. There's radiation in this room. You get radiation from eating a banana. I think what you said is so true that films and comic books... Comic books and all that. It plays to the worst aspects of human nature. We just love to get terrified about headlines, so we don't read into the devil of... We're miseducated. There is still a bias against nuclear, if you mention it to anybody. Yeah, it's scary, instantly. Yeah, but the point is we can live with it, and we have to because we're facing a very difficult situation, a cliff that we're going to go over, and it seems that no one's really getting it. So that's why I felt like the film I wanted to know, what is wrong with nuclear energy? It can work. It is a miracle. We should use it, and we should use it abundantly. The Chinese have... And the Russians are way ahead of us. They've built this. They built it, and they built it with government backing, not like the U.S., where we kind of back it, but we don't really back it. So as a result, well, China's really cutting out now, because approximately 70 reactors... Yeah, about 74, I think. Anyway, they're building, and I've heard... I can't... $140 billion into this thing, which means that they're going to build 150-some reactors over the next serious investment. Serious investment. Wow. That's a serious investment that would take a long time for us to catch up to. Oh, it's not about competing. It's about... Right, but if we wanted to do what they're doing right now, even if it's not competing, just to do... So they're the leader right now in it. Well, no. We're the biggest country in the world. We still have 90-some reactors. That's interesting. So we still have more, even with all the negative stereotypes about nuclear reactors. Planning at least 150 new reactors in the next 15 years. 150, yeah. More than the rest of the world built in the past 35. Wow. That's... I'm surprised you remember. No, it just says it right there, the article. Oh, okay. Jamie just had it pulled out. Jamie's a wizard. Look at him over there. He's the best. He doesn't know what the film is about, even. This article that you just pulled up, Jamie, this is... Yeah, and this is from 2021. This whole thing is exactly how you lay it out in the film. It's almost like we have dictionaries, and if we don't, we're screwed. China's building, man. They don't fuck around. Now, they have a lot of coal. They're still building coal plants because they have a huge demand. And the atmosphere as well. The more nuclear they build, the better it will be. The contamination from coal is terrifying. We showed a documentary that had been done... Do you remember the documentary? Indiana. It was a documentary. It was all about... One of the things that was highlighting is all the people that live around these plants. And the air... their cars are covered with a thin film of all the particulates in the air. Pollution alone. I've read figures of four million deaths a year. It's just so many... so many cases of respiratory illnesses. From coal a year. That's what I've seen. But there could be more coal in the... And who knows what the health negatives are on top of that? Like how many people are suffering with illnesses and ailments because of those particulates? Especially around those reactors. Or the plants rather. It's horrible. Well, we still have coal in the U.S. everywhere. I mean, President Trump said, Trump digs coal. I dig coal. He said clean coal once. What the fuck are you saying? What the fuck are you saying? Cleaner than what? The other... We're getting tires. Now, the other truth that we miss... We know the beast and all the oil. And this fossil fuel itself is destroying the universe. Because we're putting carbon into the atmosphere. So, you know, even... it seems like a modern thing. They say, well, renewables, which are solar, and wind. Those are... we're all for that. Wind, we want solar. But they don't work all the time. They run out in the winter, at night. And it's also a problem with battery technology when it comes to those things. Well, that's part of it, too. But the point is, when they run out, what they need is gas beauty of it. It's a real clean energy. And gas does... I mean, renewables do need backup. And that backup is gas. So it's not 100%... Like, one of the issues is about storage, the waste. Yeah. And when you talked about just the size of the amount of storage, it's not... All the waste that America has used up to now in the last... since 1958, when Eppingport was built... 1958, when Eppingport was built... You could put it in a Walmart. In other words, people make a big deal about waste, but they don't realize that it's so intensive, and energy... Huge amount of energy that... It's... how do you say? Compact as a result. So it fits into... If waste itself is... First of all, there's been no harm done. So it's been buried in casks. And first of all, it goes into water for maybe two, three years. And that's a conductor that takes the radioactivity. 12 to 14 feet. They build these casks in the United States. They're concrete and steel. Concrete is a great radioactivity. Concrete stops it. So concrete and steel casks work. They can go for 100 years, and then you can go another 100 years. You realize that radioactivity drops each time. In four or five years, it's way down. It stops to almost... If you're given... compared to what, given... Climate change is so dangerous. And compared to the deaths that are already occurring every year, just from using the methods we have now. In comparison to the amount of people that have died... The amount of people who have died from nuclear that we know have been returnable. There were 51st responders who died in the actual... were the badly protected. They were sent in by a corrupt and decaying Soviet government. And still, it was not... What we think it is, it's not like Hiroshima or Nagasaki. It wasn't that enriched kind of radiation. It was a low-level radiation that exists that went out there. And they went out. The UN went in, and the WHO, and it was really exhausted what they did. And they came up with a number of about 4,000 possible deaths returnable. Now, since then, there's been another examination by another scientific organization. We don't really know how bad Chernobyl was, but nothing like what the environmentalists say is the end of the world. Or the HBO series. The HBO was... I mean, it was... I didn't see it, but I heard it was great. Yeah, it was great as tension. Yeah, I make movies, I know. You can make movies out of disasters, but movies I know. You can make movies out of disasters, but... One proponent. Nobody in... That's what bothered me. Nobody said, it's a good thing as opposed to, it's this horrible beast. No. It's like, again, myth over... You use your reason. Go scientific. Yeah. Trust the science, which is very hard to do in a world where tobacco's good for you. You know, car seat belts were not necessary. We have automobile safety. You know, all the good desire for profit. Yeah. But even this desire for profit, it's... When we're talking about renewables, you're talking... It's really interesting that that gets connected to green. Everyone says, that's green. This is green power, green energy. But there's very little that's more green than solar. Never mentioned. We went to Davos with a film. And here they are, Davos, all the world's richest businessmen, biggest guys, movers and shakers. They don't even have it on the agenda. They talk about clean green, this, that. I mean, we had to struggle to get a screening of nuclear, and we got one. So in other words, people know about it, but they... It has to become trendy, right? Yes. And it's almost really what has to happen. It's almost like that has to become the trend of being one of the people that... Sad thing, because the truth is, it worked for 70 years, and it still work. And the old ones work, but okay, we get bored with the old thing. Oh, nuclear, I heard about that. That's dangerous, right? That's the reaction. So now they're building in the US, they have 50 companies working on... 50 companies working privately with some Department of Energy help towards making SMRs, small modular reactors, that are sleek, great looking, and they all have different methods of working, including Natrium, including Bill Gates is there with a new company. Does this lead to nuclear power cars? Because if so, I'll know. Yeah, sure. Well, no, that's another... Just electricity that has to be improved. We have to... Internal combustion engines. Transportation, and aside from that, heating buildings, heating offices... Cooking. ...heat for offices, and then there's the industry aspect of it. The concrete, steel, these are huge, highly intense, a lot of carbon to make these things. And don't forget agriculture, Jesus. It sounds horrible, but ammonia is one of the worst byproducts, and you remember the Oklahoma bombing, but ammonia is terrible, and what we have to do is get electrified. Given the whole world's coming into... Look at all the people in Africa and Asia who are coming to want what we have. They see television, they see what Americans have. Have you come... Not really. Something to consider, because when you were talking about ammonia, when you were talking about just the different fertilizers and pesticides, but there's people like Joel Salatin and White Oak Pastures that's down in Georgia, and they figured out a way to... Where it's regenerative, where the animals are eating the grass, they're fertilizing the grass, the fertilizer... They use the fertilizer to grow food, and they bring in these animals in a way that it just basically contained nature. It's just the way the natural cycle is, and they have a zero carbon footprint. It's essentially... Everything sort of works in balance, and that's how it's supposed to happen. And if you look at, especially from White Oak Pastures, he had video of the runoff from a rainstorm onto... From his property into the river, which is nothing, to the next door neighbor's property who runs an industrialized farm. And it's a fucking disaster. It's horrific to look at, because you just... And the neighbor's property didn't run. I mean, how insane is it that this is normal for us? This is the problem, and they have to apply fertilizer, and they have to apply herbicides and pesticides, and make it toxic for everything. But whatever the fuck it is, they're growing a lot of the stuff. But whatever the fuck it is, they're growing a lot of the stuff. The more tolerant of these pesticides and herbicides. And that's not good. This is a problem. Fertilizer. But I can't comment on that. It's really interesting stuff. It's obviously not my wheelhouse either, but these people that I've had to talk about it. But the point is that we're going to need... Some people say, three-fourth the... We used 2050 as a gold mark, because that's the IPCC standard. They said that by 2050, all the countries of the world have to bring down the carbon emissions to zero. It doesn't work. I mean, the green renewable, it doesn't work. I mean, the green renewables are great. There's great idea. It made great sense when you saw Al Kieb dollars since the 2000 period. This is 20-some years now. And it just hasn't worked. And nobody admits it. That's what's crazy. So the only way to get the carbon dioxide out of the atmosphere is do it clean. Do it right now. You've got to get rid of gas, and you've got to get rid of oil, basically. And you've got to be severe about it. That means you have to have an alternative. A clean, cheap... Nuclear is the only one that's proven... Nuclear is the only one that's proven itself. Proven itself for so many years. And yet, nobody... It doesn't even get tilled it right, and you keep it right. It's been done time and time again. It's just that one... You know, I wish there had been more accidents. It would have really taught the lesson. Every industry has needed accidents. I mean, when they started the railroad, they thought that your brain would get pushed back in your head... Right. Because the speed of going forward has been modified into this incredibly powerful machine. We're not going to get rid of the airplane. We're going to have to use fuel. We have to use aviation fuel. And that heat is going to come from nuclear. It's not going to come from anything else. That amount of heat. So we also have to take into consideration that if the pop-out... When we're doing things the same way, whatever our output is now that's damaging, it's going to get worse and worse and worse. Yeah. And we're going to have to be more people. Yeah. Which is... I mean, people will burn wood if they have to, much less coal. I mean, they're not going to stop people from getting things, and they're going to want energy. That's going to be the problem. They have some... They are doing some great nuclear work. They have 20-some reactors in India, but they are definitely on the path of coal, like China. They're enormous for coal. So what happens? There's no luck. We can't get them out of that mess. We're going to have so much pollution. The only way we can do it is by building nuclear now and taking everything else we can throw in there, including renewables, alongside it. Well, I think it has to become something that people are aware of and becomes trendy. And that's one of the great things in the film. This Brazilian woman that lives in Austin... Oh, yeah. Yeah, she lives in Austin. Her name is Isabelle Bonk. And maybe that is how the message gets out. Yeah, I think that's part of it. I think it needs to be addressed by leaders, the leadership of, let's say, President Xi. By 2060, they will have zero carbon emissions. Well, I think you're going to... That's a vow. It's going to take someone who's got some courage, because politically, it's an issue, because people do have this false narrative in their head. Yeah. So it's going to take someone who's willing... Just started talking about, we have to switch the entire country over to nuclear power if you're running for president. People go, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa. So many people just have the knee-jerk reaction because of these films, because of the anti-nuclear power, distant people's heads, or the false narrative around it, distant people's heads, or the false narrative around it. Necessity is the mother of invention. As things get worse, it will be clear that we need new game, that we've got to build more and more nuclear, because it's not working with wind and solar. Right, but I don't think you're going to see that from a politician. I don't think a politician is going to stick their neck out. I think it's going to have to be so prevalent in the public narrative. It's going to have to be so prevalent in the zeitgeist that they think politically it's okay to be a proponent of it. Well, I think the younger generation is changing the numbers on the demographics, and I think 60%, I'm reading, are pro-nuclear now. That's great. In the US. It's probably TikTok. You know, it's a new generation. They're more scared about climate change than they are about war. Yeah. And a lot of the older generation, they confuse it. I think there is going to be a change. It has to be. There's no other way. There has to be. On top of it, it's a miracle. It's incredible. If it's handled correctly, built correctly, like Hyman Rickers of Nuclear in America, from the 1950s, they met nuclear submarines and they kept going. Just talk about the power in a nuclear submarine, how long it lasts, too. Yeah. One small react 60 years. That's insane. And also, if you put two of them into an aircraft carrier, you've seen the size of those. Yeah. That's just a giant 6,000 people can make. That's what they're doing, actually. Two reactors can make an aircraft carrier go for, I don't know, how many years? 50 years? 40 years? That's insane. It's incredible. I mean, it really is. There's nothing like it. Nothing like it. No. The fact that that is novel. No. You have a ship at sea that's powered entirely by nuclear power and it can go for 50 years. That's right. We try to show that in the film. I mean, it's just a miracle. It's insane. It's so much different than anything else. And if you just do it right. Do it and do it and do it. So you standardize it. The United States never standardized it. Japan did, Korea did. They built one type of reactor and they built it consistently. Just recently, Korea built four heavy water reactors, big ones, in UAR. So it's 5.6 gigawatts. That's a huge amount for the United Arab Republic. They'll cover a huge area. That's incredible. That's the kind of building you need to do, but you have to do it. Go ahead, please. And by the way, you can ship it too. If you assembly line it, like in Korean shipyards or something, you can build it in a way that with SMRs, parts, you can put the parts in and ship them. America, any country. Russians did that in Pevac, which is an Arctic outpost. They sent a barge. The Greenpeace, of course, predicted it would be a nuclear Titanic. And it wasn't. It arrived in Pevac. And it's set up and it's working beautifully to this day. So SMRs are shippable. And they can be built in shipyards. They can be assembled by the thousands. There's no reason not to. Now, what about if one of those things sinks? Yeah, well, water absorbs radiation. So what happens when there have been nuclear submarines that have sunk, right? Well, if they did, there's been no damage. Isn't the phrase, neither confirm nor deny? Doesn't that come from a... I think that comes from an operation... I believe I heard this on Radiolab. I think that phrase comes from an operation where they were trying to recover a Russian-downed submarine. Right. I remember that. And they had to answer the question. And so when they were questioned, their answer was, we can neither confirm nor deny. Because they were put in a position where they were supposed to interact. So how do we say this? We can't lie. We can't say, no, we're not going to tell you, because we have to answer. So the answer they came up with is, we can neither confirm nor deny. Which is a beautiful... It's very eloquent. If you really think about it, if you want to be a bullshit artist, that's an amazingly eloquent statement. That was the one that Howard Hughes was involved in. Globalar? Is that what it was? Yeah, Howard Hughes. Yeah, that sounds right. Yeah. Never heard more about it. Whatever happened to happen. The world's like... The world doesn't end. That's the thing about nuclear. Right. People say, well, when something goes wrong, it really goes wrong. But that's an exaggeration, too. There's no evidence for that. But in comparison to the things that we absolutely know go wrong with just transportation, just driving. Like, deaths are inevitable when you have hundreds of millions of people. Obviously, you want to mitigate them as much as possible. You want to mitigate dangers as much as possible. But we're just victim of bad narrative. Industrial accidents. You know how many people die a year? Two million. But that's humans. We're so weird like that. Germany is the craziest of all. I mean, they're smart people. I thought they were mathematical geniuses. Well, explain what you're talking about. We originally built 20-some reactors in the 70s, and they were doing very fine with it, and they had no problems. And now they've shut them all down because of the Green Party, which is a plea, which is also pro-war, pro-NATO. You know, it's a very strange Green Party. It's a hybrid. Anyway, they came into power and they want any nuclear. So they destroyed. They shut down all their plants that were working. And we show that in the film. It's insane. And what did they go with? They replaced it with coal and a lot of solar and a lot of turbines. In fact, if you think... Look at the solar park that they built. They built a gigantic solar park in Germany. Can you imagine that? 500 acres. 495,000 panels. That's enormous. And that park, but it was producing about 100 times more electricity than this 500 acres on one-fifth the land. 500 acres on one-fifth the land. Well, there is pollution factor. I mean, just whatever the panels are, like whatever that... That's part of Earth. So you've covered part of Earth with these fucking panels. It looks gross. The turbines look gross. I drove past this turbine farm. And I'm like, how is that not bothering people? It's like eye pollution. You're looking at these things that are... These giant machines that are spinning instead of just the landscape. It looks like we're tricking ourselves. And to think 100% clean. It's not clean if all you're looking at is turbines. If you're driving on the highway and you see hundreds of turbines with lights on them so planes don't fly into them. That's not clean. Like that's a part of the problem. Like that in the environment. Well, each country... It looks like shit. Yeah, I understand. Each country is different. It depends what they want to do with their land. I mean, Denmark has had some success with it. Germany's had greater success with wind than they have with solar. That's for sure. But they're not dealing with it. We're still putting out... Yeah. We're putting out shit in the air. It's also... Yeah, I mean, it's certainly better than burning coal. It's certainly better than many alternatives. But it's still... Well, we should... In the short term... Methane is. Methane is horrible. And it leaks all along the line, as we say in the film. That's gas. Natural gas. Natural gas. And we talk about it like it's some kind of savior. It's a perfect partner for renewables. That's what they... You know, the footage of how much gas gets released from those pipes. It's crazy. I showed it in the film. We showed the infrared camera. Yeah. And how much gas right there. And that goes a long way towards destroying the atmosphere. A lot of people are upset that they're trying to ban gas stoves. People are upset that they're trying to ban gas stoves. That's a big thing. But, you know, I was like, okay, are people overreacting? Who's overreacting? And then think about it. It's just for the convenience of cooking that you enjoy cooking more with that. Is it a price thing? Because nuclear would solve the issue of the availability of power. Yeah. But would it... You know, I think people just like to cook with gas, which is really weird. Like if it's really electric... Electric? Well, I can't comment on that. I just know that methane has a short term huge effect on the atmosphere. Less. But they did recently ban it in New York City, correct? I don't know. Didn't they, Jamie? I think they banned it in... Maybe that's not the worst thing in the world. You know? Like... First statewide ban on use of natural gas in new buildings, yeah. Yeah. Because if that stuff really does lower IQs, isn't that one of the things? Remember there was something about it having an effect on cognitive function. Yeah. Which is, you know, we found out... We just talked about this the other day, but we found out... IQ points, not a giant one, but like a measurable dip in IQ points amongst people that grew up in my generation with lead of gas everywhere. Well, I wonder about my own brain. I guess, you know, we've been around long enough. Childhood asthma. Childhood asthma. That's it? Didn't say anything about cognitive function. I even typed an IQ here and it didn't bring up anything. Maybe I'm good for that. So much heat comes off nuclear that it really is not being used. Right. As the scientist says in the film. Even if it's causing kids asthma, like it's not good for anybody then. Like, if that's really what's going on with gas. But the amount of time that it would take to get the United States, like what would that take? To get rid of all of the things that are polluting the environment, all of the things that are... We give it that... We showed that graph from here to 2050, thinking backwards in trying... You have to get this thing going. You have to get the nuclear part very easy to do on these things. So in 2030 to 2040, if you're built, this stuff is going to start to pay off. From 2040 to a huge run, a huge race. And we can do it. We may not get all the way to zero, but it's certainly doable. If Rickover were in charge of a program, he would push it through. But it's not just us. I mean, honestly, the Chinese are doing their part. They're trying. They're really trying because they see the problem. And for a president to say that, Xi, when he said he's going to go down to zero, that's amazing if they can stick to it. Russia too plays a huge role. So does India. Well, they obviously have much more control over how things run. They don't really rely... But that's okay because we're talking about the Earth here. But let's talk about France. France has been nuclear since 1975. They built 56 reactors in 15 years. That's pretty fast. And they were all... they're all working. They still have those nuclear... a lot of their electricity in France, 70%, is nuclear. They have some hydropower and I think some gas, but not much. I genuinely think that it takes someone like you making a documentary about this to get the word out there to the point where people really start demanding this. I really do. Because I think over the stuff that we had growing up, Godzilla and Spider-Man and all that, that's what it is. It's like we associate radiation with negativity and nuclear power with radiation. We show images in Brazil of... Brazilians going to black sand beaches to absorb the radiation. It's good for the body. We show in cancer therapies, it's used... radiation... heavy radiation is used to kill off tumors in the body. We show Sar-Iran, which has got huge radioactive activity. It's very high and it's tremendously... they're doing very well in Iran with Ram's arn, Owen Stein. So in other words, we can live with radiation much more than we know because DNA, as Crick and Watson found, reduplicates. It hasn't doubled. So we tend... the body... the body... big argument in the old science because the Rockefeller Foundation, of course, put out the scare to the public in 1957. Where they said, you know, any amount of radiation to the body is dangerous. And that really worked. It put in the New York Times publisher put it in the... so that's where... meanwhile, the counter comes later but you don't hear about it. And the counter claim is we repair our body as we move through life. That's what DNA does. It's a wonderful story. We just have scary stories about radiation and, you know, rightly so in some cases, like the Radium Girls. Those... do you know about this? No, I don't know. They used to use radioactive paint for like indices on loom. Do you know loom? You know what that is? Like on the watch face, there's these little dots, right? Well, these little dots collect light when it's light out and then when it's dark, they glow. Well, video activity. So these girls would sometimes like lick the tip of their brush to wet it, to shape it, and they develop horrible cancers. And it's very famous. And it's very famous. They develop these holes in their faces. It's really scary stuff from very specific type of radiation. And it's also from direct contact through this paint. No protection at all. Well, I can't comment on what I don't know but... Yeah, I know I understand. So there are some consequences that are negative. Bevels of radiation will hurt and kill. Yeah, exposure to radiation. I mean, there's a reason why they make you put a lead thing over your junk when you get into an experiment machine. That's correct. And I went to a lot of that when I was visiting the plants in France, Russia, and here at Idaho, the National Laboratory, we talked to a lot of scientists. And people who handle it, those people who know, know, they don't freak out about it. Was this subject that, when you said about this, was it simply just because you had the information and you felt compelled that this... I read a book review in the New York Times, of all things, about Joshua Goldstein's book with Stephen Kvist, the Swedish nuclear scientist. And it was called Bright Future. I bought the book, read it. It was very practical, it's simple, and it goes into the truth, which is, this has been a lot of lies. And I bought the book and made the movie with him. He gave me a lot of... I had to learn a lot. I had to travel. It was difficult. It was not an easy film to make. I wanted to make it understandable to a ninth grade level, you know, trying to make it simple. I think it works at that level. It absolutely does, yeah. Definitely. It's just very important to do, and I'm really glad you did it. Because I've talked to so many intelligent people that share your perspective on this, but it's just not being discussed publicly enough. Well, it was. It was. Yeah, I shouldn't have said might have. Eisenhower was on the right path, and John Kennedy supported it completely. Remember, we quote him in the film. Ralph Nader was very influential, and he's done great work, Nader, but of course, on car safety. But, you know, he was wrong about... He exaggerated this to a degree that was not necessary. Do you think people exaggerated it because they had their own heightened anxiety, because they were genuinely misinformed? That's correct. I do believe that. Nader is the good man. Yeah, I believe so. And he still believes in it, that he's right. But if it blew up, it's not going to blow up Cleveland. And it's not a bomb. And unfortunately, that was original confusion. It's never been... But there wasn't also no one to count. Because I don't remember... Well, frankly, do you remember the guy who started Greenpeace? Moore, Dr. Moore, he was the co-founder of Greenpeace. He came out and said, you know, we were right about a lot of things at Greenpeace. Nuclear bombs, but we were wrong about nuclear energy. We got it wrong. He says that in the film. It's a wonderful statement, but again, people... I guess when you get... You hear the negative first, you don't go... It's a problem. We're slaves to our initial impressions. Well, that's the point of maturity. That's where you have to get smarter. Yeah, it's just very difficult for people to do. It's a lesson that doesn't get taught enough that you are not your ideas. And once you... You have to be... It's not you. These arguments are not you. You have to look at just the data. You have to look at the data. And just because you had an initial idea about something, don't... Exactly. Look at it correctly. Exactly. People associate themselves with ideas. And if they've espoused an idea, they somehow or another think they have to defend it to the end. And it's a terrible trap to get into. Brilliant people get into that trap. It's a terrible trap. You're not your ideas. They're just ideas. Well said. Well said. And you're certainly not a person who was anti-nuclear power a few decades ago or even a few months ago. And get new information. Go, oh, and this is where I was wrong. And that's better for everybody. And if people learn how to do that, we can move past a lot of silly shit in this country. I wish Jane Fonda would come out the other way. For her Vietnam stand. For her Vietnam stand. She could mean a lot if she understood this and came out against. But so was... A lot of the people know this. Matt Tybee, Russell Brand. They understand. They've done the reading. They're smart people. We've got to get it out. And it's going to happen. I do believe... They're smart people and they're courageous enough to just start talking about it. As I say in the film, you know, with Josh, I said, nuclear has been around. It's been discredited constantly, but it won't die. It's like some... That I think is going to be inevitable because there is no other alternative. I mean, we can talk about carbon capture. We can talk about all the things that they're doing. Fusion is a great solution. I love fusion. I was just up at MIT with Dr. Dennis Swite. He's the head of the program there. He's fusion plasma. Beautiful, amazing amount of work. And maybe it'll work in the second part of the century. But right now we have from 2020 to 2050, we've got to deal with this hump. And there's no... And fusion is not there yet. It hasn't delivered. There's also some research in converting it into batteries, correct? Isn't that it? I didn't know about batteries. I know in Russia, in the middle of Russia, I forgot exactly where it is. And it's beautifully... It was designed... It's a 600. It was designed many years. It breed more than it... It eats up its own fuel. And it reuses the fuel over and over again. That's why they call it a breeder reactor, because it breeds more. And they're using it... It's expensive. That's the problem. Can they standardize it to make it cheap too? But the Russians have done it. And now they're building an 800, which is a bigger one. So, you know, Amshi, which is a Japanese company, they're building an SMR, a small modular reactor, with some capacity. It could make... A radioactive... Are radioactive diamond... Whoops. Hold on a second. It could pop up. We had batteries. Unveils, battery made from nuclear waste that could last up to 28. So as technology advances, and obviously technology would... You know, whatever they're able to do now, or even... Have they actually done this, or is this just theoretical? This article is 2020. They unveiled a battery that uses nuclear waste. I don't know. They're saying that they actually have a functional product? Whoa. I don't know. They're already making batteries out of it. But if they can do that, I mean, bingo. Now we have a problem with electric cars, right? That was the problem. Electric cars are the batteries. That's the giant issue, is you're getting lithium out of the ground. But if they can make batteries out of fucking diamonds, and to make... I mean, how crazy is that? We're all running around on cars built on nuclear waste. No, but you still have the problem of... It has to be a country-size dimension, scalability. You know, if you're not in size, you know, we're talking about it. Look at the world map. Well, I think we have to look in terms of a long period of time. If you go back to just the invention of electric gears, we're looking at it like, oh my God, we've got to get it done tomorrow. I don't think you do get this thing done tomorrow. But I think a big step is what you're describing in your documentary. That's a big step. A big step is understanding that nuclear power is a fantastic way forward, nuclear waste. Well, now we have a... instead of a problem, now we've got a commodity. Now you've got something they can utilize. Although I remember what Bill Gates says on the field. Uh-oh. Hold on a second. Yeah, as I Googled it again, it said like, 2017 they were saying this was still a hoax, but... Wondering what the catch is. There's a diamond battery out there that really uses nuclear waste. Lasts thousands of years and involves layers of only the most miniscule diamonds. It's slightly... So scientists must combine the cells in huge numbers in order to regularly power large devices, raising the cost a great deal. And along touts the tiny share of the nano battery diamond cells as an advantage for scalability though. Take the battery for a wristwatch for instance. It consumes around 2 microwatts. E-cell would be sufficient. Okay, so that's smaller than the battery that's on your watch? That's pretty small. So if we need power at different applications, the number of stacked cells could be increased to meet the demand. That sounds like every battery. Listen, Bill Gates in the film's double-in-law exploration, as well he's doing great work on nuclear. But he says there's no battery that's going to... I don't know why he's running away from it. I think we should be very proud of using nuclear because it was a tremendous discovery by Marie Curie. I think people are skittish about the conversation. Yes, I've noticed that. Yeah. Why doesn't Algores in the film, In The Convenient Truth, even mention nuclear energy? Yeah, it's true. Good point. You know, it's nuts. It's nuts. You got a P. No worries. I'm all right back. So tritium is the stuff that they make... Yeah, I have one of those. I have a marathon watch, and it's like, even if it's like pitch blackout, all of the... That's radioactive too, and it's totally safe. That's what it looks like. That's what the Fukushima... That's what tritium looks like. Have you ever seen it on a watch hand? It's really beautiful. Like, look at, click on that image again, Jamie. That's what it looks like. So it lights up permanently. You have little... You have radiation on your wrist. Well, that's been filled with tritium. And Josh, my co-author, was saying, you know, I could drink a gallon of tritium, and it would be about the equivalent to one banana. A gallon of tritium? Yeah. And it's about what negative aspect of a banana? Just see, he says the electrons in it, and they just don't penetrate. They don't... I'm not a scientist, nor... I understand. I'm not either. So I buy it. But indicators that are nuclear. Everyone's screaming, you know, you can't dump it in the Pacific. That's what the environmentalists say. They're wrong. The water absorbs a lot of radiation. Yeah. There's a company called Ball, and all of their watches use tritium. And they've been doing it forever. Radioactive things. I'm terrible for the watch market. I never had a watch for years. You never had a watch? No, I don't like to keep track of the time. I'm very... I know the time. Yeah, you don't want to be a slave to this thing. Exactly. I want something on my wrist telling me what to do. Do you still rock a smartphone? I use a smartphone as little as possible because it's essential now. They made it... Clock, anyway. You're getting your time from your watch. Yeah, it's a clock. I can set an alarm to it, but I wake up on my... basically... The only thing I don't like about the phone is I'm always worried about losing it. I lose a lot of time looking for phone. You know, why don't they make a double of this? A DNA copy. Yeah, you can't have two because they would start using your phone. It's all about copying. Yeah, it's about getting access to your, you know, whatever you have, credit cards that are on it, and all the data that they can send, no matter what anyway. It's the weirdest commodity that's ever existed, a thing that people didn't even know was worth anything. Are you worried about using it? They have an automatic shutoff on your account, right? Yeah, but it's still... it's very inconvenient, obviously. Yeah. But it's still... it's very inconvenient, obviously. It sucks. It's inconvenient, but it's not dangerous. I use my phone to get in my car, too. It's not dangerous. Right, it's not dangerous. My phone operates my Tesla. I don't even have to have my key. I just have to have my phone. Your phone operates your Tesla, right? How do you do that? The phone is in my pocket, and I walk towards the Tesla. The door's open. And it lets me in. It like, knows it's me. I don't even have to have a key on me. It's like, hey, dude. I go, I don't have my key. Don't worry about it. We know it's you. But also, someone could take your phone, and without even unlocking it, they could just start driving your Tesla. That's true, too. Because, you know, when you walk towards the car, it just goes off. Even if your phone's not even unlocked. And it gets your phone, then they get your car. What made you so smart, Joe? I'm not that smart. Come on. Give me a break. Where'd you go to school? I'm curious. Oh, dude, I barely made mass Boston. I was in Newton. Newton South High School. In Massachusetts. Massachusetts, yeah. Some are outside of Boston. The other thing that's helped me more than anything is being on this show, and having conversations with people. Yeah. It's like, you think of education as being something. Obviously, when you sit in a classroom, you're observing a lot. You're getting a lot of education. And the kids today that are going through the workload that they have to go through to put in, to get an insane amount of work. Right. But you're absorbing information. That's the key. The key is that you're learning about all these different subjects and absorbing all that information. Yeah. And you prove it with your degree. That's the beauty of also making films. Yeah. Because you get that opportunity to spend time to luxuriate in this. You get to talk. Now, there are some 20 fiction films, feature films, and 10 documentaries. And you want to get out in the field. You want to talk to real people who are doing things. I think it's so important, especially to do the work that you're doing. How else do you relate? How else can you, you have to get out there? Well, find the thing that's bothering you. Yeah. What really is bothering you? And in this matter, it was, of course, what do they mean? This is confusing. Climate bullshit. They go back and forth. Even if you don't believe in climate change, what I found out is that I would still go nuclear because it is the cleanest of all. I think there's two schools of thought when it comes to climate change. There's the school of thought that it's not an issue. It's a natural cycle. And there's a school of thought that human beings are pushing the world to the brink of mind to come up with excuses for things. I was like, well, it's always been this way. But how much impact are we having? Ice core samples. When they try to figure out how warm it used to be and what the atmosphere was like, it's always changed. I mean, it's changed radically. But. Changed. I mean, it's changed radically. But. Forget about if it's never static. It's never like the climate is like this. You've got chaos. You've got asteroids. You've got all kinds of shit. There's no stable. There's no flat, safe. We get to this. We're on our life vest. In a nice small town? Yeah. Country town. That's what we want, right? We want this idea. But the reality is the reality is ice ages. The reality is super volks. Those are the horrific things that radically change the temperature of Earth and the environment and all kinds of things. What about that lady in somewhere in Missouri? The tornado came out of nowhere and just blew the house away. Yeah. Jesus Christ. That's crazy, too. Those are things that are. Tornado. I mean. Yeah. Those are things that are absolutely real and terrifying. I saw those in the Midwest when I was here. Yeah. They have a lot of whirlwinds. A lot of wind shifts. Oh, it's incredible. There's an amazing video of this guy driving at night. And the tornado is in the distance and you only see it when the lightning strikes. Oh, God. And it's huge. I mean, it's like city blocks. And it's in this. And they're just driving down the road watching this. It's fucking wild. Do you find it? Watch this. Look at this. Look at that. Look at the size of that. The terrifying is that. Terrifying. Terrifying. Oh, that's scarier than King Kong Godzilla. That's scarier than King Kong Godzilla. Real things. Not nuclear power. The angry sky monster that comes down and destroys cities. There is nuclear power in that. Where does it all start? I mean, the beginning of the world. We don't really know. There's no beginning. No, we don't really know. I think we have these biological limitations that we put on the universe. Well, what are the first explosions? There's a birth to death. Where does this explosion come from? Right. And before that, was there another explosion? Right. There was a great piece. There was a great, great documentary on hypernovas that I watched once. And, you know, when they first started discovering hypernovas, they thought that there was aliens having war in the sky. Right. Because there was explosions that were taking place. And then they realized that these are hypernovas. I never heard of that. Yeah. They destroy solar systems. They destroy everything. Like, it's such an immense experience. You like it? Yes. 100%. Yeah. I just don't know if it's here. I don't know if it's visited. But just the vastness of the universe itself, and if you believe in the concept of infinity, that means the possibilities of this happening exactly the way we are to put it in your head, because it doesn't make sense. But the true infinity would mean that everything that you've ever done and everything that I've ever done, infinite number of times, infinite number of times in the universe, in some other place, that's how crazy. And every other variable in between. That's how crazy infinity is. So I think that if we imagine that we're the only ones, that seems silly. Yeah. Because it doesn't even make sense. It's just too... It's kind of like nuclear bad. Nuclear is dangerous. Nuclear is dangerous. I think we think that way about aliens. Because I think there's been so many kooks that have had so many doctored photos, and everything's blurry, and just weird people that probably lied. And then compelling stories that are really confusing, like really intelligent people. Like Commander David Fraver, who was a fighter jet pilot in 2004 and encountered this thing that they tracked going from 50,000 feet above sea level. The thing they tracked, did they think it was interacting with something that was submerged? They were as it was closed. And then this thing, when it jetted off at this insane rate of speed, first of all, it blocked their tracking. It blocked whatever their radar, whatever sensors that they were using. And then it shot off at an insane rate of speed and stopped at their cat point, which is the point where they had the predetermined point where they were going to meet up in this exercise that they were doing. And this thing went to that spot, and it was 20 feet long and looked like a tic-tac. Like little white tic-tac candy. So they called it a tic-tac UFO. When I talk to guys like that, I go, well, if the Chinese have something that's that advanced that can move like that, is this some new type of technology that might be probably just the high-end military applications that they're using for drones and all these different... ...different propulsion methods. If they can go 50,000 feet above sea level to 50 in a second, like what is that? Well, if they wanted to use it, they would have done it by now. Perhaps. Or perhaps it's an alien. Or a probe, the necessity of biological life. Well, if you're an alien, wouldn't you want to visit this place and share with the culture? No, definitely not. Why not? The same reason why did you watch Chimp Empire? Who? Chimp Empire. It's this amazing documentary series that's on Netflix right now. And it's about these embedded journalists who life in this part of the... ...very deep in the jungle called...a place called Ngo-Go. And it's incredible because the scientists that laid the groundwork for this documentary, they've been studying this particular group of chimpanzees for 30 years. So, they have rules of interaction. They have to stay within, I think, 20 yards of the chimpanzees at all times. And as long as they do that, the chimpanzees behave as if they...and they enact in war. They kill monkeys. They hunt. They defend their territory. They take over new territory. They do all this stuff in front of people. But they don't interact with the chimpanzees and they don't interact. They don't interrupt their life. I think that's what the aliens do with us. Because that's what we do with intelligent primates. Why would you do any different to ensure that the chimps don't blow themselves up? Like, if chimpanzees and Ngo-Go, if all of a sudden they've developed TNT and they start soldering and they're building bombs and they're planting... Okay, hold on. You can't blow yourselves up. You can't just be blowing the jungle up and starting fires. Let's stop. If I was an alien life form, I would treat human beings the same way that I as a human being would treat chimpanzees if they started developing bombs. I'd be like, we need to get the bombs away from the chimps. If chimpanzees developed...only people are allowed to kill people like that. I think if alien life forms do exist, I think the most likely strategy is to win higher primates. On lower primates, rather. We don't interfere. We observe, but the true scientists, they occasionally get curious. And when they start walking towards the person, the person just keeps backing up. And as long as they stay a certain distance, the chimp loses interest. It's really weird. You just can't eat in front of them, behave in a threatening way, and they just interact with the chimps. And this documentary is coming up. It's out right now. It's out on Netflix. It's fantastic. But my point is, I think that if there are aliens, I think they would do the same. I think they would just watch. Just make sure we don't blow ourselves up, watch, and let us know occasionally that we're not alone. That's what I would do. I would just like the scientists had to slowly habituate themselves with the chimpanzees. They had to slowly do it. They did it over. They had to figure out some sort of way that they can just be around them enough that the chimpanzees relaxed. And as soon as they realized they were never a threat, and then generations of them realized they were never a threat, they could do the work that they're doing. It's pretty wild stuff. I think that would do that if I was an alien. I would. Yeah. Sure. I think... It is an alien form, isn't it, a cat? Oh, yeah. Sure. So are dogs. Wolves. Wolves are... I mean, it's a bizarre alien life form. Three. A gully-informed. Oh, my God. Some of the most alien-looking stuff is in the ocean for sure. Ugh, yeah. I mean, octopuses are the most bizarre. They're so smart. They figure out jars. They know how to unscrew jars. Jesus. And they also... they can galore. Have you ever seen octopuses do that? No. Oh, my God. You have to see this. My friend, Remy Warren, what he would do is study all of the different methods that different apex predators used and see, like, is there anything you could emulate as a human being? But this shows some footage of aliens. And this is what Remy said. He goes, dude, they're aliens. He goes, you've never seen anything like it. And he had no idea until he filmed this show, I don't think, of how complex their ability to blend in is. But that's octopus. They make themselves look like coral. They make themselves look like rock. Watch when they get over it. Look. Look how he changes color depending on what he's on. Is that the fish? Yes. That's octopus. Look at that. Watch what he does. He blends in with the plant. That's pretty wild. And he blends in with the texture of the soil underneath the plant. Is that because there's a predator around? No, because he's a predator. Oh, I see. So as these fish swim in looking to eat, this octopus is hiding. Like, they have octopuses that... Google octopus kills shark in aquariums. Jesus Christ. Yeah, they camouflage themselves to look like anything. Look at this. Watch how it does this. Wow. Just get some good footage of this. But when they get over it, they've done it like cuttlefish, which are also similar. I think they're called cephalopods. They do it where they've done them, where they try to emulate a chessboard. Oh, Jesus. Yeah. How bizarre is this? Very. So, you know, I wouldn't want to be... Are they changed their texture? I don't want to be an innocent fish around here. I mean, what a crazy environment. Like, look at this thing. It's fucking bonkers. That's an alien. I mean, if we found that on another planet, we would be like, what the... Weapons. Yeah, they probably definitely have studied these things. Figure out, how are they doing this? Yeah. Instead, they're sushi. We turn them into sushi. That's right. We turn them into... We just grill them. That's scary. That's an insanely fascinating... ...remove from us that they're okay to eat. Well, if you think about it, no. I mean, I stopped eating eels and octopus. I don't know why. I just... And I stopped eating... No. Yeah. A chicken, I don't eat at all, but eggs is different, I think. They're earlier chickens. Well, they're not even earlier chickens. They never become chickens, because there's no rooster. That's right. Oh. They're just non-fertilized eggs. They're totally... It's like karma-free. Yeah. Like, as long as the chicken's living a good life, they don't... Right. Well, I don't want to be... Chickens, I don't want to eat at all. I mean, I saw that Netflix documentary years ago. Game Changer, was it called? Mm-hmm. You ever seen that? Yes, I have. Yeah. Yeah. It's turned me off. It turned you off. A lot of the problems with these studies that are associated with whether or not meat is bad for you... Yeah. ...or what they're doing is basically they're asking you to take a serve. What they're doing is basically they're asking you to take a serve five times a week or five times a week, and then they make some sort of a correlation. They say, well, they consistently had more cancer, more of this, more diabetes, all these things. Which may be true, but also what else did they eat? Because if they ate meat five times a week, I guarantee you they were drinking Coca-Cola. I guarantee you they were eating bread. I guarantee you they were eating you monster energy drinks. I want to know what the fuck they ate. Don't tell me that because the people that ate meat more, because people that eat meat more generally, if you go by the narrative, the same kind of narrative that you have about nuclear power, that it's bad for you. If you go by that narrative, the people that shuck it off and don't give a shit, those are the same people that smoke cigarettes and drink whiskey. They don't care if it's bad for you. They're going to eat meat, right? But that doesn't mean meat's bad for you. No. I have a full study on what happens when people eat nothing but grass-fed meat and fruit and vegetables from an organic farm. Let's monitor that. I bet they would do a lot fucking better than the standard American, right? That's the problem. The problem isn't meat. The problem is what kind of meat? What are you eating with meat? People have been eating meat since the beginning of time. That's not the problem. And if you look at human beings, you look at photos of people on the beach in 1970, right? You ever see that, or 1950, 1960? And then look at people on the beach today. Yeah. That's not meat. That's not meat. You talk about obesity. Yes, an abundance of complex carbohydrates, an abundance of simple carbohydrates, an abundance of food, just too much food. I noticed that. Way more food than your body is burning off and you get bigger and bigger and bigger. And the food is addictive. I think that's the question. 1930s. Oh my God. In those photographs, it's quite shocking. Yeah, they didn't. Well, also, preservatives have allowed us to store things on shelves. People binge eat in the middle of the night. On the other hand, we did muscle up a lot, didn't we? Oh yeah, we got more jacked. Yeah, I think people also learned to... The eight more larger learned how to exercise better. It became more of a thing. Like, actually, you really should just do it. Whereas before, it was probably seen as a luxury. You know, when people had to work all the time, it was harder lives. They didn't think of getting fit and muscular as being important. What about women? Yeah. Do you ever talk about that with them? I mean, why didn't... should they work out? Oh yeah, everyone should work out. I think just to maintain your body and thing. Do it in a really smart way. If you can, do it with a trainer. But everyone should do something. Whether it's yoga or push-ups or sit-ups and chin-ups and body weight stuff. You can get an amazing workout done with a chin-up bar and just your body. Just your physical body weight. You don't really need to go to a gym, but you really should get someone to show you how to do stuff if you don't assess your physical ability. You don't want to get a person who just started to go run like David Goggins. That would be ridiculous. But you want them to be able to build and continue to push themselves, but they're not getting hurt. Yeah. That's what you got to do. I say that to everybody. I think everybody should do that. It's just my suggestion. I know people that are very happy that they don't exercise at all. It is possible. It's just not possible for me. And I don't know what it's like for everybody else, because I'm not you. Everyone's different. It seems like we are anyway with everything else. But for most people, if you just want to maintain your physical frame, if you want to maintain... I don't know what makes less sense. If you don't use your body, it breaks down, and then you can't get around. That sucks. And when you can't get around, a lot of it. Just keep your body fit and strong, and you don't have to worry as much about all the things that plague people. You're going to have to worry. We're getting old. But you worry less. You worry less if your body works well. Much less. Well, we got out of this with change. Yeah. No? We got out of this with change. Yeah. It didn't exist, which I believe it does. But if it didn't exist, I'd still advocate nuclear energy. A great point. And the IPCC, when they did their... I believe them. Their body of scientists, there's a lot of them. I mean, I think 200 of them. No, I believe in them. And the IPCC says 2050 is a marking point. And you go back and you check their charts from 1980s, and you find that from 1980 to 2000, they were accurate. And then you go from 2000 to 2020, and they're accurate, very close to accurate. In fact, they were a little bit more optimistic. But now, you have to believe it. That's a 40-year span. Now we're new. Considering these charts and saying what they're saying. I mean... Yeah, absolutely. You see the hurricanes, you see the winds, you see that the storms are bigger, it seems to me. Well, I don't know if they're bigger. I think the new argument is that... What is the... I think the storms have actually lessened in intensity, but increased in the amount of them. I think that's the data. But all not good. Whatever we're doing... See, the problem with me with climate change is that I always get wary when things become ideological. Exactly. When people start talking about this. And how much are you just saying a narrative? Right. Because a lot of people want to argue ferociously about a narrative that they didn't even really looked into that much. And it's... That's... It's a natural cycle. No matter what, it's a natural cycle. The earth warms. I go, how much work have you done on this? Do you know how crazy it is to be that sh... That's the whole reason why they're having this debate. It's because no one can definitively prove how much of an impact we're going to have on us. What's going to happen? No one can... How can you be so confident that it's just a natural cycle, but it's a right wing? It's all bullshit. It's a natural cycle. Like, bro, how do you know? But you know because you don't like the people that think that we have to... Engines. You don't like the people that think we have to stop and close coal plants. You don't like those people. You think those people are annoying. So you've decided to be annoying in the opposite way. Right. And that's what it is. Go to a city with horrible air. Yeah. Like Los Angeles used to be. Like India is now. How do you feel? Terrible urban environment. You know, brake dust that stuff that you get on your wheels? No. You don't know brake dust is? No. When you're using the brakes in your car, what's happening is there's this hydraulic pad that presses against a disc. Stops your car from moving forward. Right? Okay. So when that happens, it makes powder. And this powder goes in the air. And the powder gets all around your wheels. A nice car and you want to clean your wheels. There's all this black shit in there. That black shit is brake dust. And that black shit's everywhere. Lucian. Compared to just 7% contributed by exhaust fumes. Cute. As all cars give off brake dust, there is no such thing as a truly zero emission... Same method of slowing the car down. Of slowing the car down. Yeah, of slowing the car down. It's the most effective method we know of. And that's what happens. Yeah. Does it happen less in carbon fiber brakes? Is it the same effect on carbon fiber brakes? Google that. Well, you have... I don't think it does. I don't think it leaves the same amount. Does it say anything? Yeah, carbon fiber brakes brake dust. Or metallic pads and produce less dust. There it is. They also last significantly longer, can tolerate a greater range of temperatures, and fade less as they heat up. Track reports this. I have a car that has those. Well, I'm learning a lot here. Yeah, carbon ceramic brakes produce virtually zero brake. I mean, like they literally do not dust at all. That does not sound scientific. Do not dust at all. What's on the wheels will be what... Do not dust at all. What's on the wheels will be what's on your paint. Normal road dirt from driving around. Yeah, that's what I've found just from... The pessimism in the air that you feel the dystopia in movies, you constantly see it. Hate those movies. You know, there's always about negative... the sensational stuff. And the news, the media, just thrives on sensational bad news. I mean, it's wars, this, that. So they make you afraid. Do you think this is... like we should be afraid? Do you want to live afraid? What are you afraid of? Those questions. I don't think we should be afraid, but I think we should be aware. And I don't think that... Look, this demise fear, it exists because it happens. Like civilizations collapse. You can go visit ancient Rome. You can look around. You can see the Colosseum. They're not there anymore. Those people are gone. The people that built that admit, that's going to happen to us too. And it's going to happen to us biologically too. So there's this constant fear of so many different things that we carry around with us all the time as you hold a Day of the Dead skull. Okay. I don't think it's healthy to live your life embracing that. I think you've got to be aware of it, but you've got to live in the moment, as stupid and corny as that sounds. That's the only way. Otherwise, you're going to be freaking out from anxiety. If you can't just live in the moment, you're always going to have too much anxiety. In my experience, with me at least. These people who talk about radioactive waste, they're thinking like 10,000 years ahead. And even then, it's the radioactive isotope just decays and decays. Well, not only that, like if they really do have technology currently available where they can convert that into batteries and... Oh, that's great. This is 99% it decays. You can swallow the 1%. Right. You can. You can swallow it? Yeah. Not a lot though, right? I really swallow it all the time. Don't swallow it all the time. Well, you know, there is a certain amount of radioactive material in our bodies. Sure. The banana is the most radioactive of the foods that we eat. No, what foods are radioactive? I know what airplane travel is. Banana. Yeah. You want to check that out James? I bet rocks are aren't they? Like rocks? Yeah. Banana contains about 450 milligrams of potassium and when eaten, exposes the consumer to about 0.01 mmrem due to its K40 content. Wow. A chest x-ray delivers 10 mREM. So there you go. Yeah. Interesting. So it's the 1. I mean, it's 1. Oh, 0.1? Okay. Mm-hmm. What about air travel? Like isn't that like getting an x-ray? They say stewardesses and pilots, absolutely. Do they? Three times a level. Yeah, are they in danger? We're exposed to low levels of radiation when we fly. You'd be exposed to about 0.035. Million seabirds. Okay. Of cosmic radiation if you were to fly in the United States from east coast to the west coast. This amount of radiation is less than the amount of radiation we receive from a chest. Interesting. Well, that's... those are the most severe things, the x-rays, the dental and MRIs. When did doctors start leaving the room? You actually get the fuck out of here. I'm doing this every day. I don't know. Well, I want to know that. When did... because they must have stayed in the room for a while. They're like, I'm going to go around the corner and you stay here. Bro, it's like they're setting a bomb. I'll just kirk over you. It's like they're setting a bomb. I don't know how to... Well, when you think about things like the iridium girls, you know, the horrible... Yeah. Iridium girls rather, the horrible... Well, he died eventually. Remember? She looked with the... He started using shields. How many years of it did she do it? Okay, the shields... I have to be around them, right? They were wearing a shield like a fucking... like a jouster? Well, I mean, that's what they give you at the dentist office. I'm trying to figure out like how to... It's not giving me a great answer on when they started doing this. Can you go to Ramsar, M-A-L-R-A-M-S-A-R? Radioactive springs that they go to. Oh, right. Where you were saying in this area is... Here. Okay. Waste level. H-B-R-A's of Ramsar. Gamma radiation levels are up to about 20 HR at waste level and a population of about 2,000 lives in this area. Annual exposure levels range from about areas. So... And they don't seem to suffer any sort of health complications from this. Radioactivity is due to local geology underground water dissolves radium in urineiferous indigenous rock and carries in hot springs. These are used as spas by locals and tourists. Yeah. Wow. So they're getting a radioactive bath. And the black beaches of Brazil. Yeah. You can ask for that. Yeah, sure. They're doing it in Brazil. Just trying to find some good footage of it so people could see what it looks like. It's half... I don't know, half-ish of what the other one just was. But I don't know the comparison. Okay. So half-ish. So 170 V every year. Hmm. Interesting. It's a radioactive bee. Isn't that a movie? Yeah, it is. Older. Old? Older or older? It's an M. Night Shyamalan movie. Oh, that just came out, yeah. Yeah, I just watched it. Pretty good. It's one of them movies, you know? What's called Old? Yeah. That's what it's about, yeah. Yeah. But in that movie, it's not so good. I mean, I don't want to give a spoiler a little bit of it away, but... Yeah. So the concern that people have about radiation, about... Overblown and exaggerated. Overblown and exaggerated. And now, how else do you kind of get this message out? Oh, we're going everywhere. I mean, we went to all the Harvard. We went to MIT. Well, we're going June 6th, which is next week. June 6th, we're going wide with the digital. We'll be on iTunes, Amazon, Google Play. Netflix wouldn't take it. Really? That's why we have to struggle with this thing. We have to get the word out, and we have a... Glicks wouldn't take this. Because it's controversial, and then, you know, it's the same... But they have a lot of controversial stuff on Netflix. Why are they scared of that? Even game changers is controversial. Well, okay. Why do you think? That's the problem. It just doesn't seem like... You never know why they turned down. The documentary's brilliant. And I can't imagine why anybody would not want this to get out... Well, they turned down Untold History. They turned down Putin interviews. You know, it's just every time I go into an area. Why? Is it a business decision? I mean, what is that decision? It can't... History's also fantastic. What is that decision based on? Is it controversy? Are they trying to avoid a certain kind of political controversy? It's my fate. Is that what it is? It's a bummer, though, isn't it? Yeah, it's a bummer. So, but anyway, we'll get out this way, and we'll go. We'll just keep going around the world. I'm going to England to address the Royal Institution of... something or other, and scientists. It's going to be available on iTunes. It's also going to be available on Amazon Prime Video. Google Play. Google Play. And really, it's going to be available on Amazon Prime Video. And really, ladies and gentlemen, I can't urge you enough. Go watch it. Watch it and take in the information, because it's pretty stunning. And it's really well put together. And the fact that it's a death is heartening, because it really does have hope. It's a hopeful film. It's a film that's like, hey, wake up. We've got a real solution. I wanted to make it hope, because it can be done. And why do we behave like we can't hide from this? Right. We have to be like Hyman Rickover, that kind of attitude. Go forward. And can do. Can do. What kind of resistance have you received from people when you're bringing this film out? Have there been any? No, I'll tell you exactly. I mean, we went to early... We went to Venice Film Festival screening. Then you send it to the U.S. festivals, like Tellaride and Sundance and those ones. And one lady who runs one of these festivals told... I don't want to run it. That's sort of kind of a strange attitude. Crazy. I know it's going to create controversy, but I just don't want anything to do with it. So she might be from the 70s, that generation. She's listened to Ralph Nader. She's terrified. She's like, well, I don't know. Well, it's one of those things I went for. I was glad when they stopped using it. When I heard they were still using it, I was like, that's terrible. Why would they use nuclear power? I had no... Politically correct. Right. Well, it was just this message. And again, it's a great plot line for film. I wish I could do it as a fiction, but I don't know how... Someone, one of your customers... How could you do it as a fiction? I feel like you'd have to figure out some way where it's significant that it happens in a two-hour film. Something that's going to take place over the next five of these things. The problem is you get into a female scientist saves the world kind of scenario. It gets to be... Yeah. Alone day, right? Yeah. Yeah, it's very strange. The guy who made Big Short, he was very talented, Adam McKay. And he did that film with Starcast about theories out there. You saw the film, and I'm talking about... No. Caprio Streep was in it. What movie is this? It was Netflix. What's it called? I don't think I saw it. Adam McKay, last film. Yes, you saw it. I bet it was. But it was bogus in the sense that it was about an asteroid or something. Don't Look Up. Don't Look Up is what it's called. Don't Look Up. Oh, I didn't... Let me see. I mean... The problem coming. I heard it was great. Well... But I didn't watch it. Why not? I just didn't have the time. I just... Other things were more interesting to me. There's water in this thing too, if you'd like. Oh, yeah. And there's coffee as well. Yeah. Some of that. Not that it wasn't interesting. I just never... You know, it's like there's so much... It's really just a... I definitely want to watch it, and I was going to get around to it eventually, but I don't watch that much stuff. I'm too busy. So I don't have the time to like... Did you see the last sixth game? I did not. No. You did not? I generally don't watch basketball. But it gets exciting at the end. It is very exciting. When you get to the competition. No, I love... When I do watch it, I love watching people compete. It's exciting. Yeah. It's fun. I enjoy it a lot. It's just I can only watch... For the amount of time I have and the interest that I have, I can only really watch one sport. Which is Jujitsu or something? Martial arts. Martial arts. Yeah. So that's really... It's combat sports. It's the only sport that I can really watch on a regular basis. Oh, that's... UFC. UFC. That's boxing, wrestling. That's everything. I concentrate on combat sports. Are you going to watch the seventh game? Which is on Monday night, tonight. I do not know. You should. I may force myself to watch it now. It's a great story. That was a great story? Yeah. Tell me the story. Because what you're going to call it. Jamie thinks it's so funny. I know how much we have to catch you up, Joe, to find out what's going on tonight. It's impossible. In game seven, there's a whole lot of some story. One team is... It was up 3-0. Which team? The... Miami Heat. Miami Heat. They were up 3-0. 3-0 and the other team, Boston Celtics, they've been around forever. They came back. They won the last three games. Oh boy. 150 teams of trash. What's the... Really? This is the first time anybody's got to 3-0 and won up coming back? It's happened that they've gone four times, but only one time in the last 30 years. Wow. So the question to a sports fan would be, what's the outcome? Is it going to work for the underdog now? No, I'm excited. Or does the one who was... The original underdog was Miami. I wasn't excited until now. No, I'm excited. You see, Celtics have been a terrific team and they have great experience. And here they were down and they've come back. So what is the outcome? Will the gods intervene? The Trojans or the Greeks? I mean, you kind of have to know it's a battle, you know? Well that's why things of chance are so fascinating. That's why boxing is so fascinating. Did you watch the Devin Haney, Vasil Lomachenko fight? No, I missed that. It was this insane fight. And Lomachenko, who is the older guy, he's about 35 years old, just served in Ukraine. He's a Ukrainian and he served protecting his country for like a year. Took a year off of boxing and then came back and had this... It was so good. It was just this crazy back and forth fight that most people thought, or a lot of people rather thought Lomachenko should have got the decision and he didn't get the decision. It's very unfortunate when stuff like that happens too because then people don't appreciate how good they're thinking about as Lomachenko should have won. But Devin Haney fought amazing too. It was a very good fight. I mean, it was a really, really top high-end fight. Like the consequences of that, going into a fight like that, when you're watching something like that, like anything can happen. It's such a wild risk. Old champion. The greatest two 135-pound fighters alive and they go to war in front of the world. And watching something like that, to me, it's so... There's so much... I'm so interested in it that I don't have really time for this. What about dating? Do you date? No, I'm married. Oh, you're married. I didn't have the time for it. I have time. Yes, I have plenty of time. I have time for stuff, man. But I have to be smart about what I do. And I can't... Like if you think about how many hours a week it is, if you have basketball, football, baseball, all these different things you're watching as well. There's no time left. Where's your time coming from? Right. There's no way. I can't get involved in too many different things. Well, I relax sometimes with idle time. I let myself... Okay, I'm off... I'm off... I'm off on duty. That's a good move. And I just enjoy watching old movies, which have nothing to do with the world today, which is more like a fantasy. It's good to be bored too. It's good to just... It's good to be bored too. It's good to just sit around. It's good to be idle. It's good to sit around and just be alone with your thoughts sometimes. I know. You're so constantly being inundated with other people's thoughts. It's like... Too much. This is... I think it's also just the way people behave on social media is an after effect of it, is that you're just constantly inundated with people's opinions and thoughts on things, because you're always looking at something. You're always looking at a television. You're always listening to people talk. There's always someone giving you input. Always. All the time. Except when you're asleep. Except when you're asleep. Do you sleep? Yes. Normal hours? I like seven a night. I like seven a night. Eight a night if I'm working out really hard. Seven a night is good. Yeah. Seven a night seems to be function... Eight is ideal. Right? But seven is like... I can... If I'm under seven, I get dumber by the hour. Whatever the hour is, like five hours, I'm dumber than six. Four hours, I'm dumber than five. It certainly haven't been dumb today. You've been pretty sharp. Thank you very much. I got some sleep. What do you think?