Kamaru Usman Reflects on Colby Covington Fight | Joe Rogan

And so this strength and conditioning coach that you've been working with from the beginning, give us like a, what is a regular routine for you? Like what kind of shit does he have you do? Dr. Peak, okay so we just, we started getting back in there literally last week. So you took a little time off. How's your hand? Your left hand? So that's the thing, I went and, I know the doctor's gonna hate me for this. I had a cast on, so then I go to Vegas and I talked to the doctors, you know the UFC doc and those guys in Vegas and you know, it's not broken. You know, it's just an issue with the ligaments. You can see, seeing this right hand right here at the bottom of the thumb, you can clearly see the ligaments, you know, all working there. But then here, there's that bump in between, so they don't come out as much. And that's causing me, I don't have, I don't have the strength like, you know, being able to pull. And this is a big part of my game, is if I get around you, I get a body lock, I don't care what you're doing, you're just not getting me off. I've spent years just working on that grip to where you're just not, you're not letting me off until I let off. And so now, not being able to do that, but it's healing fast. And I was in Vegas and the doctor's like, we can just cut the cast off and make you a hard removable one that I can take off on and off, so I can shower, because that was the thing. You're stuck in this cast for four weeks, you can't really shower with it, you gotta shower with your arm up in the air. Oh, and your hand sticks so bad when it gets out. And then when it itches and you, I gotta stick stuff in there. Yeah. And psychologically, I started getting a little anxiety with it too, because it's like, I can't get this thing off my hand. I need this thing off. So sometimes I'm just laying there, I'm just like, I want it off my hand and I can't get it off. So is it a ligament tear, or is that what it is? It's not a tear, they thought it was a tear at the bottom, but strength is coming back. So it was a sprain or something? Yeah, it was like a really bad strain, and that bump is still there for some reason, so we're working on it, I'm doing everything, ultrasound and fracture, which is good news, so I don't have to be out for too long. Yeah, because you sent me the tape of when you heard it in training. So it was one of those things where you hit with the thumb instead of the knuckle? Because when you got those big gloves on, you can't really make a full fist, especially when you have wraps, so your hand's kind of in there like this, so you throw a punch the wrong way or somebody comes into you the wrong way, it's like, boom, you heard it. So I heard it at one, I'm like, gosh, what am I going to do now? So now everything's going through my head, I got this guy that's been talking shit for years, and everybody in the world is telling me, you have to kill this guy, you can't lose to him. Now I'm going through all this in my mind, I can't be that guy, I can't lose to that guy, I can't lose to that guy. And then it's like, then I'm like, okay, no, it feels a little better, I'm going to spar hard. So I start sparring, boom, right away, heard it again and out. A couple of times I almost cry. And you're getting it taped up hard too. I'm getting it taped up and everything, but even so, it's still hurting. But then it gets to a point where I'm just like, shit, you got to block it out. Fight the fire, you got to block it out, so I'm in a dressing room, I'm in a train, everything's okay, I block it out, I'm not even thinking about it, I'm thinking about going to work. And then I get in there in the first round, I don't even remember, I just remember throwing it, boom, something's wrong. And I'm just like, okay, play it off, play it off. And then Prostikov, he comes on and he's doing his job, he's fighting me, he's in there landing strikes, and I'm like, okay. But at some point I never thought I'm going to lose this fight, because I never think like that. It's like, oh, I'm not going to lose this fight. Even if something's not going my way, I'm going to adapt. Wasn't it like on the, the score cards at the end of the fight were very close. Yeah. I knew it was close. Because for the first time ever, I asked my coaches, did I win that round? I've never in my career done that. I'm the type of guy, even when I was wrestling, I'm the type of wrestler who, I like to run up the scoreboard. I don't like to leave any doubt that I won that round. I'm going to dominate that round, I'm going to make sure I won. So in my head, I know I won, I don't need to ask. For the first time in my career, I went back, I'm like, did I win that round? Did I win that round? But even by me asking that, I never thought, oh, I'm not going to finish this fight. I always knew I was going to finish the fight, but I just was like, I was, did I win that? Did I win that? You know, I don't know why, I don't know how or what, what was going on in my head, but for some reason I asked, I was asking. So I knew the fight was close. It was a good fucking fight, man. It was a good fight. The thing about Colby is he tricks you into thinking he sucks because he's got a goofy suit on and he talks crazy and, you know, he wears the MAGA hat and all that stuff. But then if you didn't see any of that, if you just watched him fight, you're like, that motherfucker puts a pace on people. When he did a Robbie Lawler, I was like, good lord. Like, nobody does that to Robbie Lawler. Like, he put a fucking pace on him. It just stayed on him. Like, guys have wrestled him before Robbie, you know, like, got ahold of him, dragged him down, tried to make it a, you know, a state, you know, try to stall him out. That's not what Colby did. Colby just stuck on him like glue and just put that pace on him. Yeah, I mean, he really showed, you know, like how good he is. And I mean, I give respect or respect to him. I'm no hater, you know, I know this kid can fight. I know he was good. I know he was tough and I knew he was a competitor as well. He's always been a competitor. I knew guys that were on wrestling teams with this guy, you know, besides John Jones. I knew other guys, you know, that I'm good friends with that wrestled with him. So I've always known that he was a competitor, that he was going to come out and try to compete, you know. But like I said, I just mentally, I think I'm just on a different level than these guys just because everything that I've been through, that I've done in my life has shaped me into the man that I am. So mentally, I'm just on a different level than him. Well, you have to have that attitude, right? Yeah. And I just, I felt it. I knew it and I felt it even. And now more so than ever, because now you've got all the fans, but, you know, on what he's got his fans, you've got everyone has fans that are going to talk shit to you. Well, there was the first time that you had a close fight in UFC, which is kind of crazy. I mean, think about your career. It's pretty fucking nuts. I mean, you win the title over one of the best welterweights of all time at Tyronn Woodley and you just dominate him, right? You think about all the other guys, dos andos, all those guys you smashed. And I mean, that's, you had a crazy run up to the title and then a crazy title winning effort. And then this was the first time we saw you in like a very close fight. Yeah. I mean, uh, a test to him too, like he's a tough guy at the end of the day, you know, to make fantastic fights, you got to have the right dance partner. Yes. And Frazier needed Ali. They need each other. And he was the right dance partner. And to be honest with you, you know, if I didn't take too much out of him, because each fight takes something from you, you know, internally. So if I didn't take too much from him, I think I might see him again, to be honest, because it's clear that we are the two best guys in the division. And so, yeah, I mean, I look forward to seeing him again. I think you guys will see each other again. Yeah. And some guys get really wrapped up in the fear of looking bad. Yes. The looking bad is just like hanging over their head. I'm about to get knocked out. Everyone's going to laugh. That's very great. I'm going to make fun of me. They're going to fuck with me. Can you imagine me losing a Kobe coming down? That would have been the biggest one, right? It was so much. Oh, my God. It was so bad. I'm telling you, I'm in different cuts. And I mean, Abu Dhabi, people run up to me in the mall. Man, I can't wait for you to kill this guy. I go, I'm in Brazil. Oh, my God. I can't wait for you to kill this guy. I'm in Dominican Republic. They can't even speak English, but they're like, I can't wait for you to kill this guy. And everywhere. So I can imagine me going out there and what I was feeling. I had to really I took advice from Rashad. I had to really make friends with that feeling and accept it. Well, I'll tell you what, man, at the Wayans, when Susie painted the Nigerian flag on your face and you're staring them down and you just had this big smile on your face, you look so calm. I was like, that guy is ready. Yeah, but you were so composed at the way. And I was like, there's no bullshit. There was no fuck you. There was no no emotions. You just had a big smile on your face. Yeah, I mean, it's at some point you get to the word. It's no longer the talk and like, now I get it. You got to sell a fight here and there, you know, this and that. But I try to stay as true to myself as possible. Like, obviously, I understand people want to be entertained. And I'm going to do the best that I can now of selling a fight without going too far out of myself. But when that when that contract is signed and I know that I have to go in there and take care of business, there's no more of that. Like, I have to be myself. I have to be real. And this guy said a lot of things that were very, very personal, you know, a lot of things about my previous manager, you know, a lot of things about my team, my current manager, you know, and a lot of things about my family, my situation as well as far as my father, all of that to where it really hit home to where it's. The best way for me to teach you a lesson is not by going in there fighting angry. I have to go in there being calculated like my normal self and really teach you a lesson because anything you say can and will be used against you inside that octagon. What was he saying to you? He was talking to you. I couldn't hear because it was so loud in that the arena when you were way in. What was he saying to you? I think he was saying, I'll be ready. I hope you're ready tomorrow, Junior. Hope you're ready. Hope you're ready. I'm I'm coming. Hope you're ready tomorrow. I'm coming. He seems so calm, too. He had a big ass smile on his face. But but but, you know, when I look at these guys, I'm looking for more than just that. Like I'm reading his body. I'm reading everything. And he's looking at me the whole time. And he did the best because I know he's a competitor. He did the best he could to hide his fear. You know, and I was afraid, too. I'm afraid. Every one of these fights, you've got to be afraid. But I make friends with it. I'm OK with being afraid. I'm not. I'm not worried about it. I am OK with that. So I'm watching him. And there's there's a moment if you see that Wayne video, we stare down one year after we stare down, we stare down and I'm watching him. I'm watching the whole time. I'm just watching him and he's doing this good job. He's trying to stay on me, stay on me, stay on me, stay on me. Then he looks away and I just read his body. I'm just like, OK, I know how worried he is. I know how worried. Isn't it weird? Like, you know that your opponent is worried. You know everyone's worried, right? Everyone's nervous, but you've got to kind of see it. Yes, you could fuck yourself in your mind. This guy is not even scared. Yeah, I'm scared and he's not. Yes, you can mind fuck yourself, even though you know, it's not even like everyone before a cage fight has to be nervous. Absolutely. And and yeah, it's weird because I'm looking at him and I'm studying him and I'm seeing the level of fear that he has. And, you know, I'm I'm trying to assess the level of fear, whether it's something I can deal with or something that should I'm just going to have to go in there. I have no choice. He looked pretty fucking confident. He was very confident. But, you know, I can see where how superior I was in there to him. My level of fear and his level of fear. I can see where they were at because and you've got to be mindful of his level of fear as well, because you occasion animals, very dangerous animal, you know, and so I can I'm seeing them. And that's kind of how the way he that was that went. I watched that fight again the other day. I was playing in the gym while I was working. I was like, that is a crazy pace like you fuckers came out guns blazing. I mean, in my opinion, is one of the very best welterweight title fights ever. I mean, it was epic. It was epic. I'm watching the pace. Yeah, there it is. I'm watching. I'm watching. I'm watching. I'm watching. I'm watching. Keep it on. I'm keeping on. I'm watching. I was talking to you. I was getting you. I'm like, I'm like, oh, there was just a little moment just to read his spirit. I felt his spirit at that moment. And I'm just like, it's not the same. It's not the same. I'm going to hurt this kid. It's not the same. But he's going to come. I was going to fight. But I'm going to hurt him. You know, at no point in that fight that I think I wasn't going to hurt him. When you dropped him in the final round, when you stopped the fight, when you dropped him, you saw him go down, what was going through your head? I was like, oh, I'm hitting now. I'm hitting because, you know, when you when you landed a punch good, you don't really feel it. And so at that moment I was kind of clipping him. I was connecting everything I clipped him with was he was feeling the power at that point. You know, I'd heard him a few times before, but everyone kept talking about his pace, his pace, this and that. And I carry power all the way throughout. That's how I train. I the power is going to be the same. The way I hit mitts with my coaches, Henry Hoof and all these, it's all the same. It's not all tap, tap, tap, tap, tap here and then a little bit of power here. Tap, tap, tap, tap, a little bit. Yes, I know how to do that. I know how to mix it up like boxers do. They know how to put a little bit into this, distract you with this, then touch you with that. I know how to do that, too. But I carry the power all the way throughout. So by the fifth round, when I hit him with the I think I hit him with the body and I hit a punch. I hit him with the right hand that stunned him and he stumbled back. And at that point, I was in I was just in the driver's seat. I'm like, OK, I'm feeling him. But then I hit him with the left foot. Boom. That hurt him. I feel everyone. They hurt him because I have not barely feeling the punches here. And then when I put that cannon on his face, boom, and he went down, I'm like, Oh, stay relaxed, stay relaxed. We got time. You know, the goal is to get him out of here. I'm not going to jump on him because I made that mistake before I dropped the guy and I jumped on him going crazy, trying to get him out of there. We stay on him. We just stay relaxed and I'm going to get a nut. And at that point, I was just in you get to a certain zone to where you see him coming and he's just like punches are going by. And then I land the other one and he drops and I'm just like, OK, it's time to get on him and finish him here. Did you recognize that something was wrong with his jaw? Boom. There it is. No, I and I watched the fight over in my coat and my corner told me that his jaw was broken. I didn't even hear them. Boom. That second right hand. I didn't even hear them. Were you surprised the way they stopped the fight? No, no, but you know, and I and this is this is what I'm saying is I got to say, I was a little surprised when I look. He's yeah. I mean, you think about it like that and it's like, oh, man, he got up right right away. You know, like it was might have been an early stoppage. But then if you if you watched the last like that 30 seconds before that, you see the shots that he was taking like I hit him with that right hand. Boom. He stumbled back and was fell down. Then I was wondering if they knew that his jaw was broken. I mean, that's been a referee. The referee might know, you know, but I personally didn't. But if you see him take shots like that, you just got dropped twice. And now you're holding on to a leg. And now this is just an earmuff. You're trying to protect yourself and I'm have no signs of stopping. You know, that's the referee's job to get in there and stop you. You know, and I know some guys are like, oh, well, they should have let him go. It's a title fight. You should have let him get knocked out completely or this and that, you know, but it's a ref. Referee is not doing his job of protecting you if that happens. It's interesting that you said every fight takes a little bit out of you. Yes. And that's I think that's important for people to hear because I, you know, we've all seen fighters and, you know, like we go to boxing. The perfect examples. Mel Juk Taylor when he fought Julio Cesar Chavez. Did you ever see that fight? No. Tremendous fight. Mel Juk Taylor was winning the fight, but Chavez just kept the pressure on him, kept the pressure on him, was beating his body, beating his body, kept the pressure on him. And then finally with like literally, I think the fight was stopped with four seconds to go. Wow. Yeah. Richard Steele waved it off and Mel Juk Taylor stood up and he talked to him, but you could tell Mel Juk Taylor was out of it and they stopped the fight. Mel Juk Taylor was never the same again. He was never the same again. Terry Norris, start them after that. He started slurring his words. It was real bad. It was like that one fight took everything out of him. Yeah. There's a, there's something people don't really see. I mean, everyone's attracted to violence. Everybody wants to see the violence. They want to see you get hit. I want to see you hit someone. They want to see the blood, you know, but people don't see what this takes away from your spirit. Each fight win or lose. It takes something from you. Like only myself and Kobe Covington are going to know what that fight did to us. Now, can I do it? I can do it again next week. I have no problem doing it yet, but each and every fight takes something away from you. But is it balanced out more so for sure if you take a beating, right? But if is it balanced out by hard training and recuperation to you can maintain the exact same level or is every fight you're like slightly less good than you were before, but you're so much better that you still have enough leeway that no, that as far as the preparation and training and all of that stuff, yeah, that that accounts to it. Yeah, that takes it takes away from you. But I'm saying the act of actually fighting the fight from your spirit, from your energy that takes away from you. So you mean like your ability to get up for it? Yes, your your your ability to to fight another man, your ability to that bravado to fight another person, that spirit, that killer spirit, it takes away from you. And it could add to it. It changes that spirit in some shape, form and fashion. It absolutely does. It's there's this video a while back. I forget the fighter. He was a wrestler turned fighter. He's like bleach blonde hair. I forget his name, but I think the video is called unfaded glory. I think USA Wrestling made it put it together and it had all these wrestlers on it. You know, Brandon Slay, Trevelda Lognave, who was my teammate. A lot of different, you know, was on that video. And I watched that while I was training for the 2012 Olympics, trying to make the team. And that video stays with me, changed my mentality of how to think because it really put things in perspective because you go out there and you battle this hard match and you lose to this guy. Like, Joe, I've won hundreds of wrestling matches. I can't remember hardly any of them. The ones that I've lost, though, I remember most of them. Why is that? Because each one took something away from my spirit. Somehow I remember each. The one they took something away from me. Like, I can tell you really the fights that I won, the MMA fights, I can't really, you know, I don't really care that much about it. I win and I move on. But the one that I lost? Oh, yeah. I know exactly why I knew what happened. I knew you know what happened in that fight.