Banning Cigarettes Could Be the Start of a Slippery Slope

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Stephen Dubner

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Stephen Dubner is an award-winning author, journalist, and podcast and radio host. He is co-author of the popular Freakonomics book series and host of Freakonomics Radio and podcast available on Spotify.

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That's the house I bought to write my first book. It was unbelievably... I could focus for like 14 hours a day, 16 hours a day writing. But the reason I was able to focus so well was because of cigarettes. I'd write for about 28, 29 minutes, total focus, go outside, smoke, the nicotine, would just reset all the focus. It was an unbelievable drug, but it's a terrible delivery system. I've heard someone recently say... I recently heard a kind of reluctant Trump supporter say the same thing about Trump. That a lot of the things he's doing policy-wise, especially foreign policy or economic policy, really, they like it. So they say he's like a cigarette. Like the drug is good. The delivery system is absolutely terrible. That's interesting. Now, how is the vaping? Did you switch with vaping? I never... No, I quit smoking a long time ago. Although I quit, you know, it's interesting. I wrote in my first book, my family memoir about the Jewish Catholic family, I wrote in there not that I was a smoker, but that this one instance where I stepped outside with my brother after this intense moment and we had a cigarette. And a few years later, the book had been published. I was now newly married and I know that you're supposed to buy life insurance. And so I got this insurance broker and he knew my name. He said, oh, I read your book. I said, oh, that's great. Glad to hear. And then we started to price out the insurance and he said, you know, what do you do? Are you a smoker? I said, no, not a smoker because I'd quit a few years earlier. And then he called me back and he said, you know, I read your book where you stepped outside, have a cigarette with your brother. All of a sudden I got the smoking rate for life insurance. Even though you quit. Yeah, even though I quit. Because you used to smoke? Yeah. Oh, so have you smoked at all? Well, that's not what I thought. He asked me, are you a smoker? I said, no, because I'd quit. Anyway, isn't there like scientifically, there's a certain time window where your lungs are fully recovered. They also say, so this message I would say is really serious for anybody. Even if you've been smoking 40 years, they say if you quit, your lungs can actually recover greatly. So it's worth it. Yeah, I think smoking is, I hate to say it, I think smoking is a terrible idea. It's a terrible idea. There's no if ands or buts. On the other hand. Does vaping replace the feeling? Adam Curry switched to vaping. He had this crazy contraption. One of those guys using a really complicated garage remote control looking, vaping things. He's into those things. He quit and that's how he quit. So the best science at the moment says that vaping is almost certainly much better than smoking. Yeah. Because they don't know all the chemicals and all the potential damage that vaping may or may not do. But they do know the damage of cigarette, combustible cigarettes and all the chemicals there are demonstrably pretty bad. Yeah. So even though like you said, we were told doctors do it, this is the best. We were told the same thing about sugar. Sugar gives you a great boost and so on. It's awful. But again, my take is if you want to smoke, go ahead. Well, but wait a minute. You live in a finite life. But wait a minute. Let's say now we are talking about who pays, right? So this gets back to the externality thing. If you smoke and I'm paying for your health insurance as a taxpayer, don't I get to have a say? It's a very good question. And how far should we extend that? Because if you're fat, should I have to pay? Right. You keep eating. Why do you keep eating? Right. Okay. If you don't sleep well and you're prone to heart attacks, is somebody supposed to pay? Right. Why don't you sleep more? You know, there's so many variables. Are you a guy who rock climbs? Well, what if you fall and break your leg? I have to fucking pay for that? There's a lot of variables that you got to wonder about when you start breaking down how much assistance people get based on their life choices. But the way to do that is to price it. And this is where economists are really useful. Price it out for the individual and punish them for their behavior? Not punish them, tax them, charge them, right? If I want to be a rock climber and a smoker and in everything, but I get free healthcare, then there should probably be a premium or I should probably pay into a little fund that is a pool. Well, it's not free if it's a premium, right? Well, it's never... Look, healthcare is never free. Right. Not in this country. But no, no, no. Even in Scandinavia, it's free to the user at point of purchase. Right. Yes. But no, it's expensive. But we're talking about the user. And that's what's in Scandinavia has done well. We're talking about the user though. Right. We're talking about the user having to pay a premium. But you're right. You're already paying your taxes. Let's say you're paying 20% total tax, whatever that goes into the healthcare. But then additionally, right, theoretically. I think it's very hard to regulate behavior because again, where do we draw the line? What about BMX riding? What about people who do this and that? There's a lot of things that people do. Basically everything you do, you have to pay for. Yeah. There's so many things that people do that we take for granted. How about little girls do gymnastics? How much do the parents have to pay? How about driving in a car? Yes. One of the scariest. Right. How about so many things that people do that they take in a matter of time? We should just all sit inside with helmets and watch YouTube. Yeah. How about CrossFit? How much you got to pay? You want to do CrossFit? You know, a lot of people didn't hurt. But then we got to measure the benefit too. Yes. CrossFit. Right. You're building up your body. You're going to live longer. Well, that's possible. But then you're also probably hanging out with lunatics like you who are riding crazy vehicles, right? So. I'm a kind driver. But I think that CrossFit, the benefit, yeah, is you're getting in shape. So that balances itself out. As long as you do it intelligently, you're involved in athletics. But should we reward people? Should they pay less? So if someone does yoga three days a week, are we supposed to make them pay less? I mean, I think you get into some weird swampy area and people start to juke the system the same way when, you know, people got paid for rats, they let rats loose and then fucking killed them because people are gross. Yeah, but we're improving again as a species. Yeah. Let's not lose sight of that.